Warskullx

Join Date 03/2008

[Balance] Favor items

Two favor items stick out as much better than the others.

The generals have a general specific wand which heals the user and all units around him for 1500 health. It has either a 30 or 45 second cooldown. It looks like a red wand of speed.

Everyone has access to a red healing potion that heals for 800. It isn't as good as the wand, but it is still pretty darn good.

These items stick out as far more powerful than the other items available through favor. If I am a general, running any other favor item seems crazy, an instant 1500 HP heal, I am using that. In general straight mana boosts and health boosts should probably be avoided in the favor items as those will shine beyond the others.

One idea is having the general's wand not heal the general that uses it. However, this still seems pretty powerful in a general team.

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Giving Generals access to unique favor minions would be interesting. You only have one slot - do you want angels, giants, something new, etc. It'd also radically differentiate the same Demigod played by different people.

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The +15% speed boost favor item is probably a bit too good also. It seems to stack with boots of speed making it almost required for most heroes. Perhaps a solution would be to make it be +15% faster, plus you get an extra burst of speed for 5s (60s cooldown.) However, in return make it so speed boost items no longer stack and only the greatest speed boost is applied.

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Keep the feedback coming!

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I really don't like the abundantness of speed items. Most games have Demigods (UB more then anyone) speeding all over the place.

I just feel slower movement would really make you think about what your doing more.

When theres no risk because you can just speed away...it really makes you care less about your choices. Why care? You can just turn around if it goes sour.

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What about making speed boost items negated while a player is slowed? This would result in a much lower relative speed for a player that depends on speed items. The negation of the speed boost could last several seconds after the slow is over, making sure players can't depend on speed to get away at the last second.

It regards to favor items, what about demigod specific ones? As such the Rook could get an item that let him have more towers or Regulus could have an item that gives him an extra mine thrown.

Another idea I have been thinking about it achievement based favor items. They would be given at no or little favor cost when a player gets an achievement and would relate to that achievement. An example of this would be that the Patriot achievement would unlock an item that would give a bonus to flag capture speed or provide a 60 second flag lock with a 5 minute cool down.

Alternatively, achievements could upgrade existing demigod specific items. Using the Regulus extra mine item from above as an example, geting the mine damage achievement would cause the item to increase mine damage as well as provide the extra mine. Using this method, the base item would be paid for in favor and the upgrade from the achievement would be free. As a last thought, every item could have a third level that would be unlocked by getting all the achievements for a specific demigod.

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Quoting Teseer,

reply 4

I really don't like the abundantness of speed items. Most games have Demigods (UB more then anyone) speeding all over the place.

I just feel slower movement would really make you think about what your doing more.

When theres no risk because you can just speed away...it really makes you care less about your choices. Why care? You can just turn around if it goes sour.

Hmm. I agree that movement is too fast right now, which makes running away, especially at higher levels, too easy and allows for easy changing of lanes.

I'll be looking into slowing down the Demigods and reducing the overall benefit from items(especially low level ones like the Boots of Speed). Thanks for the feedback Teseer.

Mike "Tyo" Marr
Demigod Design Lead

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If I am an assassin I usually prefer the TP item. That lets me tp all over the place withotu using up gold on tp scrolls. If it is a small map like prison then I usually go with the speed upgrade. With the generals, I actually like the 50% hp bonus, particularly if there is a TB because without that upgrade to hp your minions really dont stand up to much punishment. Plus it is usually only 1 minion getting hit at a time..which makes a big aoe heal kind of wasteful. If you keep your priests alive then they'll top everyone off on their own.

Right now I'm having trouble with item diversity more than anything. I find myself buying the same items over and over again because the other options are just not as good for the cost. I think in larger games the items granting auras would be great...but in the 2v2s that are happening now, the aura items dont seem to be worth the reduced bonuses.A lot of items seem to have fairly poor modifiers as well, which makes me go with the items that tend to give you the basic +hp, mana, regen type instead of the 1% chance to shield from damage and so on.

The best item for cost is by far the speed wand. 250 gold for a great speed boost to escape or chase that will almost always be useable when u need it with such a short cool down. This is just too good for the cost.

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On the topic of speed, permanent speed boost items become pretty close to mandatory. They have been this way in every AoS game I have ever played because increased movement is so powerful. There is a huge pressure for every hero to grabs boots of speed early. Perhaps the permanent speed boost should be a rare and expensive item, so instead there is a real decision made when building your hero.

Some ideas for a speed light item set:

Wand of speed: Drop cost to 75, make it single use on a 60s cooldown.

Boots of Speed: Remove item, replace with a cheap dodge item

Anklet (favor boots): Reduce to 5% speed boost (maybe very slightly higher, but the number should be low) have it activate for a speed boost similar to the wand. This is expensive in the fact that it costs your favor slot for a small speed boost. I think favor items in general will need a rebalancing to get them all to be a certain level of desirability though.

Cloak of Elvenkind (the relic that currently gives speed, dodge, and teleport): Reduce speed boost to 15%, maybe slightly lower. Probably up the cost to 15k-18k.

An infrastructure similar to this would make the speed boost items much rarer and difficult to get and reflect the true power of a speed boost. A player who buys the anklet sacrifices other favor items for a small speed boost. The wand is a great speed boost, but if you use it carelessly, it will be unavailable when you really need it. The cloak is an extremely expensive, but a true speed/movement advantage.

As it stands in every game the group I am playing with goes for speed items quite early.

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Wings of the Seraphim looks like it is probably too good also. +200 HP regen is a lot, makes it effectively a rather large heal over 10s. A small passive aura in conjunction with a much less powerful active ability would be better.

Ideas to rework healing items:

Red Potion: Provides +10 HP/Second passive regen. Activates instantly, after activating provides 20HP/second regen for 20 seconds. This regen is non-combat and ends if you take damage.

Blood Soaked Wand: Passive +10 HP/sec regen for holder, activates a 10s combat buff. +20HP/sec, +attack speed, +movement speed (small), +armor.

Wings of the Seraphim: +5 HP/sec aura, activate for an increased heal aura (but smaller than the current one, say 50HP/sec.)

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