innociv

Join Date 02/2008

+34

Armor modifier - Encouraging spreading out, discouraging ganging

For refernce(Demigod base armor, and armor increase for level varies. So these are rough numbers for reference):

Level 1:
~350armor:	~12% damage reduction	(Base)
~2350armor:	~48% damage reduction	(+2000 Bonus)	36% gained by bonus

Level 15:
~650armor:	~21% damage reduction	(Base)
~1850armor:	~42% damage reduction	(+1200 armor item)	21% gained by bonus
~2650armor:	~50% damage reduction	(+2000 Bonus)	29% gained by bonus
~3850armor:	~59% damage reduction	(+2000 Bonus, +1200 armor item)	21% gained by item, 17% gained by bonus

Now, I made this table so you have a reference of the sort of numbers in what I'm proposing.

The Bonus I have there, is because what i'm proposing is that for each Demigod, beyond one(1), attacking another Demigod or a structure, I think it should get a 2000-3000 armor bonus. So if a 2nd Demigod hits an enemy enemy within a few seconds of the first one, they get this 2000 armor bonus for a short duration, and it keeps refreshing when they both keep attacking. Three at 4000 bonus.
Ontop of this, I think damage should be increased by about 25% for all the demigods.

The end result is that 1 on 1, one person will be killed faster. There is less chance of someone able to flee, or teleport away. It is easier to kill in a fair equal one on one fight. But with ganging up on someone, damage is reduced. It also makes it where your DPS is decreased when focus firing on a tower, but it's increase when spreading out on them.

Ganging up on one person is so powerful. It's easily the most effective, and sometimes only, way to kill someone. And everyone pushing down a lane, rolling down a line of towers is so powerful too. Some things need to be done to encourage spreading out.
Then that ganging in the begining, getting kills, getting gold, makes it where you more easily get to a point where one person is super powerful in the end.

This isn't something that wipes out ganging up, it hardly makes it much less effective because of the damage increase pretty much negates the armor gain. What it does is increase damage in 1vs1 fighting, without making ganging MORE effective. It's kind of like ganging is the only option to get kills unless someone is stupid early on. You use that ganging to gain levels, to gain advantage, so you finally can solo people at later levels. I think solo'ing should be easier, earlier on, when things are more level.

The main issue i'd see with this, though, is it's not intuitive. But it's not like it couldn't just be explained in the tutorial.

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I like this idea, but off the top of my head I'm not sure it will discourage team ganks unless something else changes. That's because Spell damage isn't mitigated by armor at all, and some of the most effective combos right now are stun nuke stun nuke or slow slow slow slow - four spells and you are out. Give more armor when ganged up on and you've made spellcasters more powerful than dps when alone and when in a group.

Personally I think the game would be more balanced if spells were affected by armor, anyway - and it would allow a system like this to work.

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Yeah. But spell damage is usually half the damage dealt to kill, if that, with most all demigods except for TB.
But it doesn't discourage ganging so much as make solo killing effective enough that you don't HAVE to gang.

I agree though, as another point, that spells should be effected by armor. I also think they should be effected by weapon damage.

I think Scathis or Tyo said LONGGG ago that they WOULD, but they don't as of now, and i'm getting a feeling they won't.
It should be (Spell Damage)+(Weapon Damage+modifiers). And armor should effect spells damage, but cap at like 1500 armor.

Or it could be changed that it simply reduces damage a set amount, like 35%, when another person is attacking. But then you'll run into situations late game where someone is really powerful, and you need to gang him to kill him, but you can't because of that. The +2000 armor makes it so someone who has items to survive better isn't getting much of a bonus(like in my example someone level 15 with +1200 armor armor is only getting a 14% bonus to armor from being double teamed. Much less than 36%)

Yeah.. really armor needs to effect spell damage, and +damage items effect it.
Plus, doing so would give +damage items an edge over +attack speed. +attack speed items would be for more DPS and trigger effects, while +damage for more spell damage.

Might as well try and solve two issues with this thread.

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tesb

Join Date 03/2008

+302

i smell shield mitigation

edit: i love this smilie

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Yeah it is like shield mitigation.
And savage2 has the opposite thing. When more people attack a building, it's armor drops. This is to make it so a single person can't destro ya building, or cripple economy from you having to use gold repairing damage. But 5 people will drop a building like 25x faster than one.

It's a good mechanic that I think would work well. Not how savage2's is, the opposite of it. And just effecting demigod's attacking other demigods and buildings. The shield mitigation is a nice mechanic in sins, like mentioned above.

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If you need an explanation to make it make logical sense...

"Demigods, being arrogant beings, rarely use the full extent of their power. As circumstances require they may tap into more of their power, such as when they are teamed up on by their brothers and sisters, in order to become more durable."

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It doesn't really need to explaination to why it happens, it's just the whole intuitiveness. You wouldn't know it's happening unless something said it did is what I was saying is the only issue i see with it.

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The only issue I have with this is that I'm dubious about any idea that appears to discourage teamwork. If something like this were implemented they ought to put something else in that encourages people to work together while not making one method of operating (for example gang-up-kills) so much better than any other method that it is the only one ever used.

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Two people would still kill someone faster than 1.

The bigger issue is more how it's so hard to kill someone 1on1, and it's so easyyy to kill 2vs1. There is like a reliant on ganging.
Not that I think teamwork is bad. It jsut sucks that you're screwed if it's 2vs1, and 1vs1 is pretty impossible early game. Later on you can win 1vs1's by being strong and slow stacking, or just being way way better, though, yeah.

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Quoting innociv,

reply 8

Two people would still kill someone faster than 1.

The bigger issue is more how it's so hard to kill someone 1on1, and it's so easyyy to kill 2vs1. There is like a reliant on ganging.
Not that I think teamwork is bad. It jsut sucks that you're screwed if it's 2vs1, and 1vs1 is pretty impossible early game. Later on you can win 1vs1's by being strong and slow stacking, or just being way way better, though, yeah.

Yeah, I feel that.

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