Nucleus Accumbens

Join Date 03/2003

+15

Sedna Yeti... on STEROIDS

The way I see it, the General's minions are supposed to have the following unique characteristics:

1. QoT Shambers: range attack, some AoE

2. Sedna Yetis: high hp, high damage, low #'s

3. Oak's Spirits: low hp, high mobility

4. Erebus Minions: easy to create, average health, average DPS

So, erebus' minions might need to be nerfed just a tad (lower health?), but this post is about Sedna's Yeti's. I suppose the biggest problem with Sedna is that there just aren't enough viable builds out there. Most people play support-health build, and then there's some differences of opinion on the relative benefits of leveling Pounce vs. Inner Grace (for instance). But few people play pure general-minion builds with Sedna. In fact, when I see a player summoning Yeti's in the game, I instantly assume they are a noob (for better or for worse).

What if Sedna's Yeti's were MUCH more powerful but demanded her attention/mana, so that she couldn't play as strong a support role. I mean, like almost Giant-level toughness. Let's look at some stats:

Sedna's Yetis (currently):

HP: 810 -> 1110 -> 1410 -> 1710

DPS: 18 -> 22 -> 26 -> 30

Giants:

HP: 1650

DPS: 100

Ok, so what if Sedna could summon a single yeti (and only ever have one out at a time), but it's stats were more like a Giant.

HP: 1000 -> 1400 -> 1800 -> 2200

DPS: 50 -> 100 -> 150 -> 200

You can see that by the time Sedna gets to level 3 Yetis, they've actually surpassed Giants. Remember, there's only 1 out. It's like Sedna's bad-ass bodyguard. In fact, it's almost like another Demigod. I envision this super-yeti being larger, much like the size of the Giants in the game. This guy can really do some damage, but there's a cost...

Mana: 600 -> 900 -> 1200 -> 1500

This huge summoning cost means that Sedna can really only afford to summon one while next to a crystal. Once in the field, she need to take care of it if she wants it to survive.

If this wasn't enough to balance things, you could make it so that when the Yeti is near Sedna, it significantly reduces her rate of mana regeneration. So it can take advantage of her healing wind, but that makes it harder for Sedna to cast too many other spells.

Just throwing the idea out there. I think it'd be fun if at least one of the generals had a super-minion like this, and Sedna seems to be the best choice.

- NAc

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actually i really agree with u here and i hope they implement this. I prefer many minion builds. Maybe at the end of the skill tree of the yetis she could get like "Life Gaurd" which gives her the ability to have more than one out but causes all of her healing skills to be much less effective, which gives her a much diffrent aspect, instead of support/heal. Maybe they can also passively heal her for the damage they do cut in half? Good idea dude and signed.

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This Post is amazing.

I'd say something actually like 2 yetis out like this. One would seem a little underpowered. But lower the dps to something more like 50 -> 50 (now 2 yetis can be summoned but requires 2 casts) -> 75 (each) -> 100 (each) and they have a building damage bonus and have an area attack that does 100% damage to target and 35% damage to everything around the target. Now the level 15 skill would increase this damage.

Now the health also is kindof low so I'd say something like 1000 -> 1500 -> 2000 -> 2500 because a level 20 isn't going to be stopped at all by a 2500 health yeti have the ultimate level 15 skill do something like an extra 500 health. (going with what I said above it could also boost damage by 35%)

Now this would make yetis very powerful in the endgame and I'd say it would need to become another passive skill to boost yetis beyond the original stats. So maybe health and damage like this:

Damage- 40 -> 40 (now 2 yetis can be summoned but requires 2 casts) -> 65 (each) -> 85 (each)
Health- 1000 -> 1300 -> 1600 -> 1900

With bonuses like this in the passive skill:

Damage- +10 dps, +20 dps, +30 dps, +30 dps and increased splash percentage to 50% of the original damage and more splash range
Health- 250, 400, 550, 700

Now with this we incorperated a passive skill for yetis that actually makes them more effective to the point where 2 get threatening expecially with a sedna boosting that damage all the more.

Now you see that with 1 yeti the bonus of an item that gives minions 200 health isn't nearly as significant. Now 12 nightwalkers all with +4 damage might be 40 dps but a yeti with that might be something like 2 dps overall. Having 2 makes it that much more effective. Maybe you could have these items work 3 times as well on a yeti or something scaled.

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i also agree with xaviorsfist. His concepts are great, but i really do agree highly with 2 yetis. I think to make them trully worth it at the end, there would be a skill called "Elder Yetis" and it gives em like life steal for you, mana steal and tons of damage and health. They would also slow attack adn move speed of enimies to give em more dg killing potential, because frankly senda does not have much, other than pounce and her beastly auto attack damage.

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the problem with having a single super summon is that it benefits less from items which are for instance +10 minion damage which erebus and oak can take huge benefit from. What would be nice is some items that are x% based since that scales just as well with minions that are few in number but high in stats

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awuffleablehedgie

Join Date 04/2009

+60

Keep in mind, however, that most minion buffs are not incremental, making a quantity-minion build stronger than a quality (Hauberk of Life, the 1750g, armor gives +200 Minion HP. This helps Erebus minion swarms (10x200 == Giant) more than just a single Yeti or two).

Therefore, having at least two @level 8 is pretty important. It would be interesting to see the final tier skill do something like 'increase all minion-buffs by 300%' or something like that, though you'd have to balance whether or not Morale would be included in this (think 5 points in Morale and then that... you'd have minions with more HP than a UB...).

Interesting idea, I'd like to see it built up, because I do think EVERY skill should be at least somewhat viable given a situation, even the already strong characters (eg, Bestial Wrath for UB).

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i love the idea about giant yetis and i agree about items needing to be more effective on them, maybe make it so items have double bonus's becouse if sedna had 4 yetis orginaly and now she has 2 then the items should give bonusus as tho she still has 4.

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Good idea. This was acctually what I though the skill would do without reading about it (without reading the tooltip).

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Hmm...

Seems to me that sedna is well balanced now.

-She can heal

-she got dmg attack with interupt

-silence is a kind of stun

-She got speed stacking skill

-Passive healing for her and friends

-SHE IS A GENERAL

Look at all of that - to me seems quite a good combo. Yet you guys want to give her minons which are practically another demigod in game.

I really think her minons were created to be weakest ones - created to support creep kill coz she dosnt have AOE dmg. To me it is very strong character now and really does not need any buffs. Adding such will bring a lot of unbalance in game

Serriusly it is very hard to die with sedna, unless you play stupid or over extend.

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besides that i think that one single yeti with 2200 hp would still suck lategame (i mean... 2200... thats one slam + 2 auto attacks) imo the yetis need a buff.

irek. nobody says that a healing sedna is weak, but who really uses yetis? why should a skill which isnt used in any good build stay as it is?

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Yetis and shamblers need a buff. THis is due to the limited numbers and the way that items that buff minions work. As stated above, an LE or Oak get much more out of items that help minions than Sed or QOT.

Either we need items that do a % increase, or the units themselve need a slight buff. I dont htink having less than 4 is a good idea, but they definatly need larger buffs as you lvl the skills.

Yes sed is viable without Yetis but that doesnt mean yetis should not be viable.

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awuffleablehedgie

Join Date 04/2009

+60

Quoting irek1988,

reply 8

Hmm...

Seems to me that sedna is well balanced now.

-She can heal

-she got dmg attack with interupt

-silence is a kind of stun

-She got speed stacking skill

-Passive healing for her and friends

-SHE IS A GENERAL

Look at all of that - to me seems quite a good combo. Yet you guys want to give her minons which are practically another demigod in game.

I really think her minons were created to be weakest ones - created to support creep kill coz she dosnt have AOE dmg. To me it is very strong character now and really does not need any buffs. Adding such will bring a lot of unbalance in game

Serriusly it is very hard to die with sedna, unless you play stupid or over extend.

All true. Of course, this is about making another valid build, which would sacrifice these things. Assuming a 'build' puts at least three points into this by level 10, this means you're doing something else worse. This isn't about 'buffing' Sedna, it's about making every skill viable.

Of course, if every Sedna Build required one of these monsters in order to be competitive, we would have a problem. But from the very beginning it would have a tradeoff:

Do I get heal level 1, or Yeti's? If I get Yetis, I can summon at the crystal save all my mana. If I get Heal, I'll be more useful during the first engagement/I won't be targeted so badly.

Plus, what if the Yeti's actually had a movement speed penalty (let's say 10%), basically making it a mini-Rook. This also makes it less effective at suiciding into towers for kills. Now, you can compensate by starting with Swift Anklet, now your minions can keep up... but you gave up Cloak of the Night or Blood of the Fallen.

Maybe I get Blood or Cloak like normal, and say 'screw the slow mana-draining minions, they will just act as tanks'. Well, it won't be useful against a beast or Ereb due to natural speed buffs, and most other characters have some other skill to boost speeds. Now you can't catch them. What do you do? Do you use points that you could put into Pounce or Heal and put it into Grace to make them faster? Do you buy Boots of Speed at your second shop?

Clearly, as long as every viable build of Sedna doesn't require Yetis it isn't a straight-up 'buff'. It's build diversification.

I would love to see UB Wrath become a viable build option. Is it a buff? Of course. Might it require a little bit of balancing? Perhaps. But then it would become PURE melee, no Spit or anything ranged to worry about. This is better in some situations than others, just like a Yeti Sedna would be.

I think that EVERY tree should have some sort of viable use to it, and you literally SHOULD have to think 'hmm do I want this or that?' after every level. Of course, if you're an Assassin Erebus, Morale I isn't going to be on your list. But if you're a Minion Ereb, it will be. Making less-used trees more viable is a way of doing that.

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Sedna yetis are playable as they are IMHO (maybe they deserve a little more health).

But to play them you have to make some concessions : no early heal (and probably no heal at all) ; no high damage spells (you'll probably get pounce I but not more). And you have to play very differently.

With magnificient presence II, healing winds II, pounce I, silence I (or counter healing depending of the game) and yetis IV, you can force most DG to retreat in 1v1 situation at lvl10. You wont get the kill though, but yetis sedna is definitly not a killer.

And you still help your team : passive HP regeneration, reduce cooldown aura, counter heal, silencing ennemies... all these are support abilities, an smart UB will stick close to you and get the kills.

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no not relaly ese. They are not really playable. They are a waste of a skill point now, as they are all around weak, with very low stats.

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Sure they could use a buff, but multiple Yetis is best. Maybe have them summoned 1 at a time but have a cap, like Rook Towers but less damage (Rook Towers have range but can't move for chasing targets, and don't take focus-fire orders) and health (because you can't run in a full group of Rook Towers to tank & kill an enemy tower like a group of Yetis could do).

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