Rook improvements

He already has back tower trebuchet that "throws stones"

And why would he want to block creeps as a when he can kill like 50 of them in one hammer smash, or just use his splash damage normal attacks that do high damage?  Also, sounds boring.

I don't love these either. The current ones are more exciting and interesting (even if rook roll is imba). Turning into a wall would be intesely boring for the player, and serve very little tactical benefit because creeps will auto attack him (and consequently be stopped by him) and he'll take less damage if he just kills them.

Ha, I just found the trebuchet feature so i definately posted before knowing all the facts.

As to the wall...why have any other option than hammer smash if it is so great?  The reason I suggested it was because i have noticed that many times i am about to die but have been fighting off hordes of enemy that will rush past me once I have to regen.  I think., and again it is just my opinion, that a last ditch effort of making a defensive wall would help temporarily increase the rooks hit poinst..thus delaying being over run and will give your allies potential time to get over and fight the rush of enemy back.  The downside would be perhaps a very long regen time or something to that effect if you should in fact die.  I just think that there is alot of offense going on and maybe one good defensive option may be nice.  i think it falls well within the rook's history.

The units pushing when you have to go back to base to regen is part of the game.

Balancing the need to go back and the need to fight is an essential game mechanic. You can make going back quick by buying two teleportation scrolls for 200 gold, warp back, warp up front again quickly. They can't push that far while you're gone.

If it is a wall we are tallking about why not give him the ability to raise a wall from the ground in the direction you want and make an intresting gameplay options. I think that could be nice.

That would be an interesting counterpart to the tower summon, especially if he were slower. However, the tower summon will stop creeps just as well as they all rush to auto attack it, and it synergizes nicely with other abilities.

I think rook making walls would be dumb.

If anyone had walls it should be TB in the form of ice walls or ice prison.

That would be neat. I still prefer AoE freeze for him. I just don't like the idea of him having a long-lasting power. He should be forced to go in quickly, do a ton of damage and then leave before the tanks overwhelm him, and that isn't a playstyle suited to long-lasting powers.

I understand that and as part of that dynamic this ability would add another component to it...for the rook only.  I am really not trying to change your mind.  You don't  like the idea and think it is dumb..i get that.  Anyway, it is a suggestion...thats part of what beta testing is for.

Yes, i understand the game mechanic.  You make a good point regarding the teleport but then again...whats the point of being sent back with any delay if it can be countered so easily.? Anyway...it was a suggestion all the same.  i am sure I will have more in time.

However, i caution folks on this board regarding making statements about ideas being dumb etc. (this is not directed to this post specifically)  I am assuming the developers want a free flow of ideas...even if they are dumb. (I suppose that includes my first attempt at adding some ideas)

They probably want to know what other people think of other ideas aswell.

The ability to create some kind of passive barrier would be interesting.

I know I am being bull headed but I am still working on the wall idea...so how about this modification to my original idea.

what of the rook could build a wall (at some higher level...not at the start of the game) made out of his own stone structure.  The wall would be semi permanent (it could be destroyed but would have so many health or hit points that the act of attacking it would take considerable effort) and would eventually break down or disappear (I have no idea how long this should take).  By building the wall, the rook player will lose a level or two and any associated level ups.  This represents the fact that the wall had to be buit from his own stone structure (building a semi permanent change to the map should cost the player something). 

The issue with this idea, i am sure some will point out (besides maybe being stupid ) is that why would a player want to build a wall in the first place?  My first thought was to stop an oncoming rush of creeps.  After several folks explained why that would be folly, I still think there would be merit to it.  The maps are all very static in that nothing can be changed, built or destroyed that changes the path a player can take from point A to point B.  Towers, etc can be built that can protect an area and prevent a player from making forward progress but in the end, once towers are detroyed, the path remains the same and the player can push forward.  My thinking is that if specific routs or path can actually be blocked or rerouted through the use of player built walls, the strategic dynamic of the game would be changed/enhanced. and as I said, this ability should cost the player a lot if they do it so it may not always be a good idea.  

In the end, allowing the player to modify the map in some way is what i am looking for...hell allowing the player to build a bridge across a gap in the map would be fine by me as well.  OK, let me have it.

I like your wall idea but making him lose levels is kind of drastic.  However, making a wall would be an interesting ability to control the flow of creeps and demigods.

It would be interesting, but the problem is anything which drastically alters the flow of creeps has the potential to be imbalancing because it would need incredible durability to do so for any length of time. If it had this health, then you could damage your opponents' lines of communication catastrophically. If it weren't that durable, then it would be a glorified speed bump. I'd much prefer an increase in the number of teleportation consumables for additional maneuver techniques. Something that would set up a pair of teleport portals to shorten your lines of communication for a minute or so would be very interesting to me. It would also allow you some control over your creeps, which would be interesting. It'd need to be expensive, though.

"If it had this health, then you could damage your opponents' lines of communication catastrophically"

I agree...I that's why I think it is so compelling. But I agree, anything like this would have to be very expensive...perhaps even impose a limit to how many walls could be built. 

get 3 rooks, go into their base and build walls over the entrances

instant win

Rook has to give away some of its health bar to create the wall, with it being returned empty when the wall is destroyed?  Or they share health?

no it'd just be lame sorry..

Skills need a lot more depth, and need to be really cool.

They need to have variaty. (depth)
They need to work for various purposes. (depth)
They need to synergize with both the Demigods own other skills aswell as allies ones. (depth) (currently the rook is the only one with synergies, and he only synergizes with himself and other rooks.)

We don't need.. make a wall.

IF there was a wall it should be something you use to stop people from running away.. like queen of thorns vine wall, or torchbearer ice wall.

But then you have to give up 1 of TB's ice skills to make a wall.  And if you really want rook to make a wall, what are you going to remove?
Hammer Smash?  It's freaking cool.
Boulder?  Without it Rook will get kited to hell and be useless for everything except destroying buildings and creeps.  He has to have SOME Demigod killing power at least!  So this synergizes with Hammer Smash.
Tower of light?  It synergizes with tele-to-building, the rooks building suck, and the light tower on the rooks shoulder.
Building suck?  It's what gives the rook a lot of his base destroying power.

So you want to break the best designed character in the game to give him something dumb like a wall?

You have to TAKE AWAY his hammer smash and boulder, two skills in the game that work togethe wlel.

Or his tower, which synergizes three different ways, which is more of what this game needs!

OR his building suck, a fundamental skill for the rook.

No it's just a bad idea, sorry.

"get 3 rooks, go into their base and build walls over the entrances"

This is a good point.  I am not sure of the mechanic that would be used to preven this but perhaps a limit of how many walls allowed on the map...not sure.  This is really something I do not have an answer for.

"So you want to break the best designed character in the game to give him something dumb like a wall?

You have to TAKE AWAY his hammer smash and boulder, two skills in the game that work togethe wlel.

Or his tower, which synergizes three different ways, which is more of what this game needs!

OR his building suck, a fundamental skill for the rook."

I just disagree with you here.  We are in Beta 1 and you already think this character is as good as he can get?  I just don't agree with your points. 

1. dumb wall...well in your opinion

2. hammer smash and boulder are good but if you don't want to use the wall ability...don't.  I am not sure why you state that these other abilites would necesarily go away.

3. I am not sure I understand your use of the term synergize.  I understnd the meaning of the word of course but how is building a wall from the rooks own energy pool not synergistic?

4. Removing essential skills is not the idea. 

Please do not think I am trying to argue...I just disagree in your opinion... as lame as it may be     (sorry..I had to say it)

"Rook has to give away some of its health bar to create the wall, with it being returned empty when the wall is destroyed?  Or they share health?"

You know this question made me think...the wall health and the rooks health should be shared.  If the wall is damaged, the rook loses health.  If the rook dies, the wall crumbles.   Just a thought.

I don't htink he's as good as it gets but you're suggesting to make him worse.

I don't think you understand you can only have 4 active skills.

Also, it's just a bleh idea.

I know you aren't necessarily advocating the removal of certain skills, but you have to realize that (from what we've seen of the game), adding a new active skill such as "summon wall" would necessitate removing one of the Rook's other active skills; there are only four slots for active skills. There's always a chance that GPG can increase this, but then they'd have to redesign every OTHER demigod to accomodate the addition of one new active skill and make sure all these new active skills are balanced.