Ironic (to me, anyway) that Barack's first move was to appoint the Dem equivalent of Bob Haldeman as his COS.  Everybody buckle up.  It's gonna get interesting.

Idaho same                                     

Every Chief of Staff needs to be a bulldog.  I think you'll find his cabinet appointments very interesting indeed. 

But to equate Rahm with one of the key criminal figures in Watergate is ludicrous hyperbole.  There's nothing in common with these two men except that they are, well, both human males.

I'm sure you have no qualms about bulldogs, as long as they're your bulldogs.

Yet another irony - you accusing someone of hyperbole.

But, I'll make it more specific for you - 'the Dem equivalent of Bob Haldeman before he effed up' - that better?  You claim to have been around since WW2 or so, so it can't be because you don't know what his rep was.

Frogboy: I admire and respect you as CEO of Stardock, for what you have made of it; however, I do have a problem with your political views... or should I say, your interpretation of mine....

Again, what I've said has been misinterpreted!  My entire point is about the entire US Nation putting party politics aside and getting on with rebuilding the country... the broken economy.  Sure there are people who are unhappy about Obama being elected, but it's a fact and they need to get past that and unite with the nation and get behind the President Elect to begin that rebuilding process, regardless of Party affiliations/allegiances

You no doubt are an intelligent guy and I have no problem with your liking Bush, for whatever reason.  You are entitled to your views as I am to mine.  However, and I've made it no secret, I do not like Bush, not for the fact that he often appears vague, vacant and struggling for coherent thought, but for the litany of political cock-ups; goofs; gaffs; blunders and  downright illegal activities... the invasion of Iraq based on a pack of lies, for example.  Having said that, however, I might find that George Bush is an interesting and decent human being when engaged in 'casual' conversation... meaning, I would not tell him to fuck off if he approached to speak with me.

To further demonstrate my non-partisan point: if (Democrat) Barack Obama ordered the invasion of Iran, based on a pack of lies and without the blessing of the UN/international community, I would dislike him in the same way I dislike (Republican)  George Bush, because I am non-violent and a pacifist.... and while it is one thing to defend YOUR country... it's another entirely to attack/invade another.

And with good reason, as stated above.

OK, let's see if we can differentiate between whining at those who distrust Obama (in some cases, very sore losers), and suggesting that the election is over, the time for Party politics is over, and the entire nation needs to support its President Elect if it is to get out of the shit, because divisiveness just won't cut it as any kind of solution to anything.  If John McCain had won instead, the same principle would apply... he would need the nation's support to be truly effective.

Do I think Barack Obama will make a good President? Yes!  I believe he has the ability, strength of character and spine to do the job... not because he is a Democrat, but by virtue of what I have observed in the man.  Will he be the perfect President? Most likely not!  He is human, and to be human is to err.  However, I will not put the cart before the horse and pre-judge Obama's ability/potential to make mistakes as President.  He hasn't assumed office as yet to make any mistakes, thus it is premature to criticise, judge or condemn the man....

Which brings me back to my original point: the election is over, you have a new President and Vice President, so make the best of it, forget the Party politics, and support putting the country back on track under the new regime.

In other words, swallow or spit out the sour grapes and get back to working as a united nation, not a Party divided one

 

That sentiment would have come in handy in 2000 & 2004.  Not saying we shouldn't do it, in fact I'm all for giving him a chance to see what he'll propose & how he'll behave.  However, we should not abandon opposition where fundamental differences in principle warrant loyal opposition.

No, because it just doesn't matter. 

Haldeman is remembered for the CRIMES HE COMMITTED DURING WATERGATE.  Who gives a rat's ass about his personality when he was appointed?  A lot of people liked Nixon when he was elected.  He just turned out to be a rotten apple.

But let's get to the real heart of the matter here.  Are you honestly so desperate for even the whiff of red meat that you're going to bag on the man because he REMINDS you of someone else?  REMINDS you...

I hope that someone REMINDING you of someone else, pro or con, is not the criteria you have used in the past to make your vote for high public office.

True, the stolen election in 2000 weighed heavy on people throughout Bush's term.   But he's soon to be gone now, and there is no doubt about this election's result, thank goodness.

You don't worry that within the next couple of weeks, Pakistan will escalate their annoyance with our questionably legal bombings taking place in their country and have to SHOW us they mean business, and Bush will enact a state of emergency and marshall law, thereby not giving up his reign of the country?

(I know, I know...I watched too many horror shows in the 70s and now I'm conditioned to think the monster can't be killed...he always comes back!  At the very least, I'm conditioned to never let my guard down after the struggle is over).

I'll grant that, if memory serves me well, Haldeman was not a known quantity in the way Emanuel is - he had not served in a previous administration & had not been a Congressman.  But he quickly garnered a reputation for ruthlessness and was almost uniformly despised by the media, the Democrats & many Republicans.  Long before Watergate.

The reason it seems ironic to me (since it doesn't seem to be registering) is that there is such a disconnect between Obama's rhetoric of unity & his choice of Emanuel, who is acknowledged even by Democrats to be the most partisan guy in DC, to be a real SOB.  The last 'real SOB' COS I can remember being widely characterized that way was Haldeman.

I'm from the 'pay attention to what they do, not what they say' school.  BO promised transformative change, if you recall.  His choice of Emanuel is pure old school politics, drawn from Clinton's White House no less.  Perhaps Emanuel has bought into the unity program & I'm not going to pass judgment until we see how he handles the job.  I hope the irony turns out to be misplaced, but I'm not betting the farm.

Good grief.  Once again, this from the guy accusing me of hyperbole.

That is an entirely different kettle of fish to point blank refusing to support the President Elect on a Party basis, which seems to be the case with some... those who refuse to swallow or spit out the sour grapes and work together for the common good of the nation, rather than Party.

So sure, IF Barack Obama suddenly came up with the idea of invading Iran or Nth Korea (though he's NOT likely to) I would expect/want there to be a groundswell of vehement opposition to the proposal.

With that said, I really hope the American people will become as one again and give Barack Obama a chance to fix what needs fixing... because a divided. politically fragmented USA that does not support its President will have Worldwide repercussions/consequences,  from Europe, Asia, Africa (um, that's a continent ) through to Australia.

 

We're are in heaven over here in assie arent we starkers?...........  the lucky country rocks........  thank fuck the yank election is over.........ive had a gut full of it from day one... im glad obama was elected.

first black president.............  cool.

When do you think the American people were ever as one?  (With the possible exception of mid World Wars of course.)   Being a united people really isn't our style and never has been.  I think the 24/7 world of cable news has just made it all more obvious and force fed the constant political tensions into to us all without pause.

Yeah Starkers..I have to agree with Kenwas...The American people are hardly ever "one" and are becoming even less "one" with all the immigration pouring into this country. I wouldn't be surprised if we had another civil war here. It takes hardly anything for a riot to break out for stupid shit...but when something like 911 happens...yeah...we rally like there's no tomorrow...for a few days...well...that is as long as it doesn't interrupt our TV viewing or some other mindless thing they have people distracted with. Hell...look how long it took bush to get his ass back to Washington when the planes hit.

Then of course you have the Radical Left/Right/Middle/Conservative/Liberal/ConservativeLiberal/LiberalConservative/LeftWingConservative/RigthWingConservative/NeoFascistCapucinoRightWings/DecafRightWingWithASplashOfCream or whatever other stupid titles they've come up with lately to divide us even further...and that doesn't even include all the fanatical religious group labels. Americans are about as divided as you can get. You can't tell who is who without a playbill anymore. It's no wonder half the country is on prozac or something. 

Or did not?  The country united, the democrats still carped.  The stupid ones.  The smart ones did take advantage of it.

Actually in none of them.  He may in time, but right now (unless newspeak has already started), Chararcter does not mean waffling on your stated ideals, strong body is not one where you smoke, and mind?  Have you found those other 10 states yet?

 

Yea, it kind of shows the Aussie racism - when is the first Aboriginal PM going to be elected?

Seems our house is in better order than the one down under.

Hi Kitty, long time no see!  And yeah, we are in heaven here in Oz... especially when you read things like: "When do you think the American people were ever as one" "Being a united people really isn't our style"

Yup, the lucky country rocks orright: "We are one, but we are many, and from all the lands on Earth we come ... we share the dream and sing with one voice, I am, you are, we ARE Australian."

That pretty nuch sums it up, hey!  Maybe the Yanks could learn something from us after all.  We are united as a nation regardless of race, colour or creed... except for State of Origin time...

Then it's: "Go the Mighty Maroons...stomp those Cockroaches into the Lang Park Turf."

*For those that don't know: State of Origin is a State against State rugby league contest (best of 3) between Queensland and New South Wales... it's all out war for 80 minutes on the park, and afterwards they all have a few beers together as mates.... as Australians*

Anyhow, he mightn't be a popular choice with some, but yeah, I'm glad that Barack Obama won the US Presidential race as well... he will prove himself and do a good job, given the chance.

No one is going to convince anyone of anything. Can't we just stop and change the discussion to something less controversial, say,  religion?  

I for one will always think of George W Bush as a great, strong president and a man of character, I'd drink a beer with him anytime.

 

Now, I am not saying you are wrong. I just don't understand that perspective. Bush was a multi- failure as a businessman prior to becoming a politician. Help me to understand why you feel he is great. He had alot of shit to deal with, he could not possibly come out looking good. But still.... great?

Well, I believe that mistakes aside, bad information aside, he's done a great job in taking the fight to the enemy, with conviction, no matter how low opinion polls got, he has stayed the course as he says, I believe that the decisions he has made have been from the heart.

The economy, well, thats been the fault of both sides, thats washington, wall street and any number of other influences, I'm not going to blame one man for it.

All i know, is I am safe, my kids are safe, and were not starving.... it could be vastly worse.. lets not forget that.

for sure starkers!! GO THE MAROONS!! UP THE BLUES..........    I have a cousin who plays for the cowboys.....im rather rowdy on the nights they play.........hee hee!!  Miss you too, give my luv to yr missus,

 

...when one decides to ? none have stepped up to the plate.......

Just to be clear here, I happen to think that is our greatest strength, not a weakness!  We get it together when the need arises however as shown by the fact that you are still an independant country.  (WW2) How quickly they forget.