[Feedback] Game becomes hopeless if one team focuses on itemization and another on creep spawning

from Demigod Forums

I don't know if this is deliberate or not, and I'm not sure that I like it.

I just played two games. One was a 1v1 vs. Oak and another was a 2v2 with the enemy team eventually giving up.

Let me just give a quick preface of what I'm talking about. In game 1, a 2v2, I was going along, purchasing items and occasionally upgrading creeps like I normally do. I gradually get powerful enough that I can kill both of the enemy heroes with little difficulty. I kill them about 20 times in a row, so they get annoyed and quit. Here's where the problem shows up: Two nightmare AIs replace my opponents, which wouldn't normally be a problem. The problem comes in when the Nightmare AIs start dumping all their gold into creep spawning. I can kick both their asses combined into another galaxy, but suddenly I'm swarmed on all sides by creeps. In turn, I naturally start upgrading my creeps as well and trying to stem the tide. The nightmare AIs keep dumping gold into creep spawning, and I eventually lose because even with all portals taken my own creeps can't fight back, and as soon as I clear one area there are two more that need urgent help. A similar thing happens in game 2, a 1v1.

You might say "So what, I guess you should've spent more on upgrading creeps lol" or something similar to that. But if that's the case, what's the point of having items in the game?

Anyway, I just don't think dumping all your money into creeps and making your hero a horrible piece of s*** should be an "I win" button in this game. And don't kid yourself, it wasn't because I wasn't fighting the creeps properly or anything. I was AoEing like mad, running all over the map trying to stem the tide, retaking portals when I could, etc. etc. but once the enemy got a certain amount ahead creep-wise and kept that lead, it was GG.

I think the main fault of this is the gold system. It's too linear, and gives the player few options for catching up once one player gets a serious lead.

Also, if I completely dominate my opponent in every way, and am twice as skilled as him shouldn't I win the game? It just feels like skill doesn't factor into this game much at this point. Don't get me wrong, it helps, but I dislike the idea that if you face an opponent you know you can't beat you just upgrade your creeps. Followed by constantly running away, gradually taking flags from your enemy as he runs from one crisis to another. Let alone the fact that at this point in the game when two heroes fight eachother having extreme skill only helps a LITTLE.

Maybe I'm missing some obvious way to deal with an opponent that focuses on creep spawning and running away, but I don't know. It was extremely effective and frustrating to know that I was losing a game I felt I should be winning.

I had about a 5-1 kill-to-death ratio on the enemy hero, was upgrading my creeps and AoEing, but when the enemy hero focused on creeps/running away and I didn't it was GG. I just don't like that.

Anyway, /rant. Just my 2 cents.

3,689 views 12 replies
Reply #1 from Demigod Forums Top

Also, if I completely dominate my opponent in every way, and am twice as skilled as him shouldn't I win the game?
End of quote

Here's a radical idea - maybe you're not as skilled as you think you are. I find it interesting that you lost and based on that one game you already claim there's a huge issue.

Reply #2 from Demigod Forums Top

I don't claim there's a "huge issue."


And if I did something wrong, please, point it out to me.

Star Control: Origins
Reply #3 from Demigod Forums Top

Also, if I completely dominate my opponent in every way, and am twice as skilled as him shouldn't I win the game? It just feels like skill doesn't factor into this game much at this point. Don't get me wrong, it helps, but I dislike the idea that if you face an opponent you know you can't beat you just upgrade your creeps. Followed by constantly running away, gradually taking flags from your enemy as he runs from one crisis to another. Let alone the fact that at this point in the game when two heroes fight eachother having extreme skill only helps a LITTLE.
End of quote

That does sound like "a huge issue".

And if I did something wrong, please, point it out to me.
End of quote

That's a little hard with nothing of substance to go on. Do the replays work in this build? Because if they do, I think everyone should start saving them - they're handy when evaluating (preceived) balance problems.

Reply #4 from Demigod Forums Top

If you AoE like mad and run around and such, it should counter creep spam. However I must ask where your ally was here? It could simply be that they won because it was "they" vs "me" rather than "them" vs "us".

Reply #5 from Demigod Forums Top

He was sitting trying to guard the citadel, and half the level I was =/

Didn't work, he got overwhelmed by creeps and then the citadel collapsed. I was trying to take portals (the 2 opponents kept retaking them)

Also, I have no idea if replays work, but if it happens again I'll definitely try to save a replay.

Reply #6 from Demigod Forums Top

I mentioned this in my post, but ya the only thing you need to do in this game is get catapults at war rank 6 and if your opponent does not  do the same you will win everytime. Buying items in this game really does not do anything.

Reply #8 from Demigod Forums Top

Replays are pretty buggy still.  They still get saved as LastGame.DGReplay, but they often get desyncs or stop in the middle of the game.  If you are lucky you might get one to work though.  You can't save them in the game itself IIRC but you can find the replay of your last game at My Documents\My Games\Gas Powered Games\Demigod\replays\[your profile name] or a similar location if you look around a bit, and then rename it or move it.  If there is interest, I can update the replay system at Gamereplays so you can upload them there, but I don't know if replays work well enough for that to be worth it.

Reply #10 from Demigod Forums Top

I agree with the original poster. Being able to upgrade your creeps is cool, but right now that strategy is way more powerful than any other. I think all that needs to happen is that the upper level (higher-costing) items need to be quite a bit more powerful. This way you have to choose between buying cool items or adding upgraded cannon-dinosuars to your army.  Both strategies should be viable.

 

Good game so far, looking forward to something great.

Reply #11 from Demigod Forums Top

There might be a slight balancing issue here, but personally, I can't agree.

Provided you take a build with atleast a small amount of AoE, it can be pretty simple to clear creep lanes. As long as your allies do the same, the creeps should never be able to push your lane back when alone. In fact, some posters seem to say the opposite to this thread, in that buying upgrades to your creeps just gives your enemies more experience.

Personally, I get the feeling it's fairly balanced at the moment.

Reply #12 from Demigod Forums Top

I've only played one 1v1 game, and it wasn't much fun: I beat the other guy by upgrading grunts while he bought items, with neither of us killing the other during the game. I'd suggest low grunt respawn rate to prevent being so easily overwhelmed. I agree that it's frustrating if you're the untouchable lord of the battlefield and get beaten anyway.

It also has a bearing on very skilled players who will want to play 2v1 3v1 excetera, but won't be able to, because they'll just get beaten by grunts.

So I guess what needs to be addressed is:

Grunts which are overwhelming your fortress could somehow threaten your Demigod first.

Holding all of the flags needs to have a bigger effect on the battle.