So why no normal difficulty in Singleplayer?

from Demigod Forums

Well... i am of course aware that there is a difficulty NAMED normal, but... let me begin at the start:

 

Bought the game a few days ago, and started a skirmish. Played a round against normal AI and won. Thinking: "ok, now i know how to play, let's do a tournament before getting ripped apart in multiplayer. Normal difficulty chosen and i won EVERY single map and nearly all boni. Ended the game with over 1100 points without really trying.

"Well", i thought, "That was a bit too easy lets try hard" I lost 7 of 8 rounds, it was pretty much a curbstomp-battle.

That was the point where i began some experiments and observed my companions carefully.

 

Normal: I won 7 of 8 matches while doing nothing. YES they don't need you. Every match my AI had all the time double the Level of the enemy. (beginning at level 4-5 when foes had 2-3 up to lvl 18 when we won foes had 7-10) My guys got more Gold too; enemies where not really retreating with teleports, not healing properly...

 

Hard: My AI is degraded to the idiocy of the foes in normal. They don't teleport out of trouble anymore. Enemy AI has more than double our startinggold (percieved) and seem to have always teleport and healing items.  They seem to get more XP and Gold per kills (which are easier for them, because my AI doesn't flee)

 

So it seems that normal is horribly in favour of the Player (he can just win the rounds by cranking the speed up and get a coffee) while hard is the same in the direction of the enemy AI... I haven't looked at easy difficulty, but why is it even there, when the player is irrelevant even at normal and why isn't normal difficulty set at even balance? (You know set so the player has to play at least competent to win matches?)

 

The complete singleplayer tournament is scewed up with that. You even have a Nightmare difficulty. THERE i would expect and accept blatant cheating from the CPU, but not in hard and normal.

 

Since i know the game is "final" and that will never be changed, this is more of a rant to vent my anger..... BUT COME ON.

 

demigod
3,470 views 18 replies
Reply #2 from Demigod Forums Top

I agree with this criticism... normal is far too easy, and for a new player to the game, jumping to hard and online play will be quite a rude awakening... not really sure how you'd fix this... the single player AI needs to challenge the player more on normal mode than it currently does in a way that will 'gradually' ease the player into a harder mode of difficulty...

Tho I suppose at the end of the day its just AI, and there are limitations to that when the focus of the game is multiplayer

Galactic Civilizations IV
Reply #3 from Demigod Forums Top

I actually find Hard pretty easy after the first afternoon of playing the game.. nightmare is 'hard' mode for me I guess but still not that bad

Reply #4 from Demigod Forums Top

Hard is pretty easy as long as you play every character is an asassin.

Reply #5 from Demigod Forums Top

The "easy" difficulty, as with most games, is for young children and others who just don't have much (if any) experience playing video games.  It's not designed for you or me or anyone else on these forums, so it's a little hard for us to lay judgement on its purpose.  Just because normals will win on their own even without you doesn't mean you'll be able to keep up with said normals and enjoy the game.  That said, it's superficial and patronizing even at the normal difficulty.

As for the other difficulties, I whole-heartedly agree with your criticism.  The normal AI is far too easy and presents no challenge, while the hard AI gimps your teammates so you have to deal with an enemy that has far superior income while being the only competent individual on your team.  This is absolutely unforgivable in a game which is about teamwork, and really sucks the fun out of the situation.

Reply #6 from Demigod Forums Top

As I have said in other threads the reason for this is for tournaments:

    #   On Easy -> Player team mates are nightmare; Enemy are easy
    #   On Normal -> Player team mates are hard; Enemy are normal
    #   On Hard -> Player team mates are normal; Enemy are hard
    #   On Nightmare -> Player team mates are normal; Enemy are nightmare

Normal and Easy are dumbed down. Hard and Nightmare arnt but get bonuses. There is no normal AI that isnt dumbed down.


Once they add better mod support I will look at fixing this in the AI code.

Reply #7 from Demigod Forums Top

I have to agree, I'd like an "even" playing field, i.e. where my teamates are at the hard level and so are the opposing team.  I imagine we'll be able to mod this.  We'll see

Reply #8 from Demigod Forums Top

Yes its moddable, but the issue is that at the moment installing mods breaks the multipler game.

Reply #9 from Demigod Forums Top

As I have said in other threads the reason for this is for tournaments:

    #   On Easy -> Player team mates are nightmare; Enemy are easy
    #   On Normal -> Player team mates are hard; Enemy are normal
    #   On Hard -> Player team mates are normal; Enemy are hard
    #   On Nightmare -> Player team mates are normal; Enemy are nightmare

That's counter-intuitive.  If I stipulate a "hard" ally, I expect it to be the equivalent of a "hard" enemy.

Reply #10 from Demigod Forums Top

Quoting Darvin3, reply 9


As I have said in other threads the reason for this is for tournaments:

    #   On Easy -> Player team mates are nightmare; Enemy are easy
    #   On Normal -> Player team mates are hard; Enemy are normal
    #   On Hard -> Player team mates are normal; Enemy are hard
    #   On Nightmare -> Player team mates are normal; Enemy are nightmare

That's counter-intuitive.  If I stipulate a "hard" ally, I expect it to be the equivalent of a "hard" enemy.

Thats only for tournaments remember. If you set hard allies in skirmish they are the same as hard enemys.

Reply #11 from Demigod Forums Top

Yeah hard is easy...but I haven't tried nightmare out yet.

Reply #12 from Demigod Forums Top

Take a page from perfect dark:

Easy is the same

Normal is the same

Hard has no bonuses but better ai

Demi is the old hard

God is the old nightmare.

Reply #13 from Demigod Forums Top

I agree with this post 100%.

 

I am a single-player, and I enjoy the game.  Normal is ridiculously easy though.  I just roll through it with little regard for any sort of strategy... 1/2 the time I don't even buy anything.

 

Then I crank it up to hard.  I usually play alright, keeping pace with the CPU.  But, after just a few minutes, I look over and my team-mates are a few levels lower, and they are also acting like damn fools.  They chase DG's, don't teleport out, and generally become worthless.

 

I am sure there are plenty of folks on this forum who have no problem with Hard, but it would nice to have something between Hard and Normal for more casual players such as myself.  Maybe just make the DG's on my team competent.

Reply #14 from Demigod Forums Top

I completely agree with this post 100%.

I was thinking the same thing for myself, as sometime when trying out new builds or a new character, I would just play a single player match. But, Normal really doesn't present any difficulty, and hard cheats too much. I would definitely like an even playing field. It would call for no experience or gold bonuses, just better AI.

Reply #15 from Demigod Forums Top

hard cheats too much.

If hard cheats, then that's news to me....hard is easy and I haven't even had any multiplayer experience yet...

Reply #16 from Stardock Forums Top

Quoting Phalnax811, reply 15

hard cheats too much.


If hard cheats, then that's news to me....hard is easy and I haven't even had any multiplayer experience yet...

 

He means hard on tourny mode. Hard on skirmish mode is easy...but tourny mode is damn near impossible...not because the enemy is so tough, but because your allies are so worthless.

Reply #17 from Demigod Forums Top

Quoting Duncain, reply 10

Quoting Darvin3, reply 9

As I have said in other threads the reason for this is for tournaments:

    #   On Easy -> Player team mates are nightmare; Enemy are easy
    #   On Normal -> Player team mates are hard; Enemy are normal
    #   On Hard -> Player team mates are normal; Enemy are hard
    #   On Nightmare -> Player team mates are normal; Enemy are nightmare

That's counter-intuitive.  If I stipulate a "hard" ally, I expect it to be the equivalent of a "hard" enemy.
Thats only for tournaments remember. If you set hard allies in skirmish they are the same as hard enemys.

Im not sure about that. I played skirmish with two hard AI in my team VS three hard AI and the AI in my team just stood still doing nothing time to time. It wasn't playing well at all.

Reply #18 from Demigod Forums Top

He means hard on tourny mode. Hard on skirmish mode is easy...but tourny mode is damn near impossible...not because the enemy is so tough, but because your allies are so worthless.

Oh gotcha, I'll test it out of hard today to see for myself :p