Amendoim

Join Date 05/2009

DirectX9 vs. DirectX10

O hay

I recently upgraded from Windows XP to Windows 7. With it came the new improved DirectX, which is actually causing issues for me.

I use a small java program to limit the FPS in all of my games, which in turn allows me to amp up the graphics and effects without my GPU exploding. This comes at the cost of FPS which are not even noticeable (to me, at least). I generally place the cap for all of my games at 30 FPS. It really does make a huge difference in quality of gaming for me.

In comparison: With the FPS capped at 30, I can play at max settings without hitting above 60C. Without the cap, max settings drives it up to 80C within minutes.

The issue comes up here: the program only works for OpenGL and DirectX9 and below. I didn't even realize Demigod HAD a DirectX10 mode. I'm not noticing any difference, anyway, what with being forced to the lowest settings as I currently am.

What I'm asking for here is whether or not there is a way to force DirectX9 (or OpenGL, even) mode on Demigod. Alternatively, is there a way within the game (or command line) to limit the FPS? That would be even better.

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I don't belive Demigod has a DirectX10 mode.

It sounds like the app you use to limit FPS is simply not compatible with Windows 7.

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Hah, good to know. Saves me a lot of trouble looking in all the wrong places...

Thanks for the help!

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Why do you care what temperature your gpu is running at? I've never heard anyone use fps limiters because they want to limit their gpu temp. 80C under a load is a very normal temperature for a modern gpu.

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At 70C, my GPU's fan automatically turns itself down to 20% from 100% where I usually keep it. From there the temperature just keeps going up until... well I never wait to see very long. It does this regardless of what driver I use or program I attempt to force it with (namely Rivatuner). It's actually a huge, known issue to nVidia, but they seem unable to solve it according to the forums.

Also, I enjoy knowing my GPU is always at a cool, normal temperature. It ensures I don't have to short $300 anytime soon. It also eliminates any stuttering I would normally experience in games.

Sadly, the program really does seem unable to work in Windows 7. All it is is a java program that is initiated with a .bat file calling the program .exe, what the heck is the problem...?

Just venting.

OH, reminds me! You (Neil) never said if there was any known way of limiting the FPS within the game, or within a command line parameter. I assume it's a no, but maybe you missed it? (Hopeful)

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kryo

Join Date 05/2003

+458

Doesn't even work with nTune (not sure now up to date Rivatuner is these days)?

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Nope.

The only way the fan stays in control is to not have a driver installed at all. The fan stays at steady 70% (or around there, judging from sound. I can't really monitor it without a driver...) after a reformat. It's obviously a driver issue, but I found an awesome workaround with my little program.

Why must life be so hard.

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Quoting Amendoim,

reply 4

. It ensures I don't have to short $300 anytime soon.

Sorry, Im going to call you out for that. Decent video cards that can more than play this game are around 100-150$... Only the most expensive brand new cards are $300... Not that I want you to burn your card up.. Im just saying.

On another side note, I have been trying to well over a year to burn up my old x1950 so I "have" to upgrade. Its OC, as far as I can, but still it runs like a tank.

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I'm from New Zealand. US$150.00 is at least NZ$300.00. Actually, more, I just don't remember the exact conversion rate.

Regardless, money is money, and I don't want to pay it unless I absolutely have to.

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What card are you running? If its an ATi that is a known issue and can be fixed by using Rivatuner or ATi Tray Tools to manually set the fan to 100%.

You shouldn't limit the FPS to save GPU temp as you'll more than likely be introducing lag into the game too (especially over net games).

As for money a Radeon HD 4850 is about $190 AUD which is a damn bargain for a really good card. Spend $10 more and you get a 1GB version.

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I've used this program for quite awhile now on myriad of games. It causes no problems within the game and never has. All it does is make the animations slightly less smooth. The difference is ridiculously miniscule, even when not compared to the performance increase I recieve.

As far as lag goes, it's never affected sim speed or anything else in the past month I've played Demigod.

For the record, the card is a Geforce 8600GTS. Manually forcing things in Rivatuner has no effect once it goes over 70C.

I'm still checking this thread, hoping someone will tell me there's a way to limit FPS within Demigod without my program. Maybe, just maybe.

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Personally I would just stick an 80mm fan over the top of your gfx card one and run it off the mobo. The 8600GTS was a good card, but has poor reliability record (falls in the faulty manufacturing bin from nVidia). For about $200 you can get the 4850 from ATI which would wipe the floor with that card and doesn't have the nVidia crap manufacturing process issues that have plagued their chipsets from 79xx to 9xxx chipsets.

Also have you tried a gfx card bios flash as that may solve the issue. Rare, but could help. Also try different drivers. I'm using the 185's for Win 7 at the moment with a 9600GT. No issues to report.

Personally the switch to the 4850 is what I am looking at. Would save tons of time and effort plus give you a much better gfx card

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As far as i know you can limit the FPS in Demigod without using any aditional programs, right click on your Demigod desktop shortcut and at the end of the Target textbox type /framerate 30.

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Quoting cryptogoth,

reply 12

As far as i know you can limit the FPS in Demigod without using any aditional programs, right click on your Demigod desktop shortcut and at the end of the Target textbox type /framerate 30.

HOLY SHIT YES

Wait, it didn't do anything for me. I'm going to fiddle around with different ways of typing it there. Hope springs eternal.

Man, THAT. THAT is the sort of thing I need. If there actually is that function, the kind stardock peeps should let me in...

EDIT:

According to this: http://scarylogic.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=3&start=0

/framerate 30 should work... hmmm, this better not be another Windows7 compatibility issue.

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Am in NZ too and I picked up an ATi 4650 for around $140NZ, seems to run nice and cool, much quicker than my crusty old 7800GTX and is quieter too. Whilst it is not exactly going to set the gaming world on fire with it's performance it more than handles DemiGod, CoH and CoD4 with no issues. I can run Demigod with all the trimmings turned right up with this card so there are cards suitable for running modern games around for reasonable prices.

If you are really worried about your fan you could probably re-route the power to a power cable in your PC (or to a motherboard fan header) instead of it going to the card which will keep it running at full tilt all the time (in theory).

edit: just noticed your card atm and you'd prob not get much speed increase by jumping to a card like mine anyway so disregard half of the above I guess!

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Why are people offering me advice about buying new cards, fans, etc?

I don't need better performance or cooling. I have a CPU fan/heatsink, mobo heatsink, PSU fan, a large intake fan, two out fans, a GPU fan, and a PCI fan under the card. My cooling is AWESOME. My PC sounds like a helicopter taking off when I turn it on.

The driver is simply faulty ATM and I have an EXCELLENT workaround in lowering FPS on games! (Well, generally)

What I need is advice on lowering the FPS in Demigod. Mainly, why the "/framerate 30" command isn't working in Windows 7... man, it sounds delish.

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I can tell you now it's not just a faulty driver if you have tried many different drivers. It can be a fault in the card (there were many with the 8600GTS) plus that's a pretty bad card anyway (had more issues with that card series than any other).

If your cooling is awesome you wouldn't have heat issues anyway. The quick and dirty method to solve your problem is to stick a board powered fan over the top of the stock card fan. If you don't want to do that and keep whining about the driver failing you are missing the point yourself.

Seeing as it is 3 generations old now I very much doubt there will be a driver fix. So until then try an older driver (where it does work) or try some different yet relatively new ones. If that fails then you more than likely have a fault with your card. In which case you will need to get a new one.

Sorry but I work with computers day in and day out. If you have a problem with cooling your GPU you either fix it or its game over for your GPU. Even with throttling you will end up with heat spikes that will kill it faster that a consistent high temp. Though 80 degress is within operating threshold for those chips. The FPS workaround is tbh one of the weirder (seeing as you are restricting it to 50% of the refresh rate of your monitor!) workarounds I have seen and not something that would be very beneficial.

Also please state what drivers you are using and the other drivers you have tried to solve this issue.

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The FPS trick is entirely reasonable, and extremely beneficial. People seem to want MASSIVE FPS, as if it makes any sort of difference... 30 FPS is perfectly fine.

For proof this affects many of the same card:

http://forums.nvidia.com/lofiversion/index.php?t42297.html

http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=254128

I'm gaga over cooling; it's NOT the issue here. I keep my GPU below 45C at all times. With the FPS limiter even in games it never surpassed 60C.

I made the thread asking for assistance on limiting FPS in Demigod. That's all I want. Even if I could fix the issue with my cards fan turning down automatically at 70C, I wouldn't WANT it! 70C is already too high for my tastes. I want it back to running at 60C like it was before I switched to Windows 7.

FPS limiting has never caused heat spikes or any issues in the two years I've used it. Don't knock it before you try it, brah.

And no, you don't need my drivers, because you're trying to solve the wrong issue!

*Sigh* whatever. The threads trailed off and I doubt the Stardock folk will come back. I was almost getting somewhere, too... just need to figure out why the "/framerate 30" command parameter isn't working.

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You are using a beta OS with only a single WHQL driver out from nVidia. If you are using ANY other driver than the WHQL one you are barking up the wrong tree. Plus I only asked because I AM TRYING TO HELP.

As for FPS and heat spikes, it is true as I have tried it before as have a few of my friends. It doesn't help all that much, but you are going OTT about the heat issue if you are worried about it going up to 70degrees.

Also what do you gain by not telling me the drivers you are using? I am on Win 7 myself (RC 7100) and use the 185.85 WHQL drivers (funnily d/l from Guru3D).

Why reject an idea that WORKS to cool down your GPU? It's pretty simple to stick and 80mm fan over the graphics card to see if it helps. When it got really hot here (38deg ambient) I had to stick a room fan in the side of my computer just to keep the chipset cool. If you are gaga over cooling you may be a little to focused on the temps anyway.

After reading those forum posts where a lot of (hang on a total of 5) people have the same issue with different models of card all based on the 8600GTS chipset. There was a solution posted where you underclock the chip by 100mhz and the shader by 200mhz and it becomes stable without the need for anything else (he even reported a speed increase in the card).

You may think that limiting to 30fps is fine, but it isn't. In this game it reduces the sim speed and that will slow the game for anyone who plays with you (the game runs at the lowest common denominator). Most monitors are 60hz, you are basically forcing it to run at 30hz so you are actually holding the whole process up pretty badly. Lower your clock speeds and don't FPS limit and you may find it works great

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My sim speed was always a steady 7-9 when I was limiting the FPS. Also, forcing a game to 30 FPS isn't the same as forcing a refresh rate on the monitor... it's only rendering half the frames within the game, not the entire monitor (windowed mode, anyone?). And the game runs just as fast as someone going 60 FPS, it's simply *slightly* less smooth.

(If it was a matter of changing the refresh rate of my monitor to 30hz (which isn't even possible, mind you) I would simply do so, then apply vsync.)

I only linked you two threads because I didn't want to make a huge list of topics. There are a lot more than just those two.

I'm using the exact same driver as you. I told you it was an issue with the driver, and it is, when paired with my card. This issue has been the same since the 170's...

I already tried underclocking my card. It helped with temperature, but it didn't effect the fan changing.

I realize you're trying to help, but you're trying to work around my question. It's agitating when I asked for a simple, specific thing. I also hate being talked to as if I don't understand computers. So sorry if I come across gruff.

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Looks like I am going to have to stick an 80mm over my gfx card cos the fan is cavitating and peeing me off something chronic (failed bearing I think). But anyway you asked how to limit FPS in Win 7. Well to be quite frank I don't think it's possible at the moment on the beta OS. Why not install a copy of XP on a separate partition for a while until the issue is solved?

As always there are many ways to skin a cat but by limiting yourself to just one you are disregarding a lot of perfectly acceptable alternatives. Hell I have 7 fans sitting i a draw behind me (plus my heat wave Delta Fan, 120mm psycho fan!) which have solved issues like these in the past.

I never insinuated that you didn't know about computers, however I don't have the psychic netcode to read your mind and know what you know. I approach all problems the same way, simple first and then get to the more complex solutions. If using that method is offensive then I dunno what I can do

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Quoting Kaerar,

reply 16

Sorry but I work with computers day in and day out.

I was beginning to feel it here, brah. Whatever, water under the bridge.

I switched to Win7 to finally drop all my random OS partitions, hoping for an end all. I don't think it's worth it to set up another one again.

I'll just stick Demigod on lowest settings and rock it that way until I figure out a loophole.

Could you try the "/framerate 30" parameter and tell me if it works for you?

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Update: the java frame limit program is still working on all of my other games. Demigod is the only game that it's stopped working for since the switch...

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Can't test framerates at the moment so I couldn't really tell if it was working.

Win7 is good but not stable enough to be main OS IMO, mainly seeing as any punkbuster game won't work properly. I have two other partitions and I always have an XP based backup in case Win 7 cans it.

As for frame limiting, I'm sorry that there is no specific way to get it working with DG (probably something in the way DG works). Personally I still think the easiest thing is the fan but good luck with the Frame limiting.

And the waters cool man

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Quoting Amendoim,

reply 22

Update: the java frame limit program is still working on all of my other games. Demigod is the only game that it's stopped working for since the switch...

Yeah well...you're not alone and the problem seems to lie withing Demigod code. Why ? Here's why : when I go to the Pantheon side selection screen, my GPU temp rockets to 101°. In half a second. Then as soon as I'm out of this screen it goes back to normal.

Opened a thread about that a few weeks ago, no one cared

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