TB+Any General is my favourite Combo in 2vs2. In my Experience it is the only combo which really is on par with 2 Generals in 2vs2 - Assassins are more useful in 3vs3 or bigger imo.

It seems that TB and other AoE characters would benefit greatly by fighting in large-scale battles (3v3+), or against generals who use minion builds. As I cannot play anything above 2v2 myself, has anyone else seen a difference in his effectiveness as player totals scale upward?

Ugh...TB is the worst Demigod when it comes to motherfucking annoying tards who ragequit after first blood. For sure. Doesn't help that he and Rook combined give up first blood 80% of the time, among matches in which they're in of course. Those 2 also happen to be the 2 Demigods that take the most skill to play, much more than the other 2 assassins, and somewhat more than the generals.

I came across a TB today who was really effective, but it was very fishy. Not sure if he took fireball or not, but he was in ice almost the entire time. He spammed attacks really quickly for 200 damage each even though I had scalemail and nimoths, and was running really fast, while snaring me like hell, and seemed to have unlimited mana because he was spamming rain of ice upon recharge it seemed. And it's not like he was fed. I didn't die cause I was uber-cautious but I wasn't able to do much.

That was me, I'll write a guide and reveal the mysteries sometime.

But definately no fireball.

This intrigues me. Please do.

I forgot about this guide : http://forums.demigodthegame.com/357298

I play my TB a lot like his, just with very different itemization. Always use Anklet, and start with Gauntlets of Brutality/Banded Armor, enjoy your early kills on the millions of stupid Reguli.

  I played an auto attack ice bearer for a while too.  seemed like it would be good but over all it just turned out "meh" for me... just didnt pack a big enough punch.

Rain of ice is easy to spam with serpents dagger or if its the only spell you cast.    I also would max my stat skill line.  

Basically serpents dagger +25damage.  then gloves of brutality +25damage to start.   Also when TB switches to ice mode he gets a pretty big damage increase, so you are dealing some pretty heavy ranged damage right off the bat.

  also since people are revealing secrets..  Ice TB and sludgeslinger combo is the true anti auto attack combo..  but auto attacks really dont matter much in 3vs3 or more due to spike damage.

Well played TB is one of the hardest DG to move out of lane from game start to end, but I see soo many wrong (imo) views about how it should be played.  Admitiedly, I play almost exclusively Fire, but:

*) TB is anything but glass cannon.  As I have posted a number of times, TB almost doesn't need any other item but HP/Armor ones and doesn't sacrifice anything by stacking HP and Armor.  Consider that a full fire/ice build still leaves 5 points to put into enhanced attributes and you get a TB at level 20 that has pretty much same or more base HP as any other DG.  I regularly have among highest HP in any game from start to finish.

*) +70 auto attack damage is insane on a kiting demigod early game.  Coupled with area denial of Circle of Fire makes any DG have trouble staying in a lane.

*) Fireball is 150+dps kiting after level 10.  That is anything BUT insignificant, no matter how much HP you stack.

*) TB damage stacks very well against HP stacking.  Consider that your dps for the early/mid part of the game is primarily hindered by mana.  As your mana grows, so does your continous dps.  And as Fire TB you get pretty much infinite mana at level 15.

The only bane of (at least Fire) TB is vell played interupts.  Sedna, Oak and Ice TB can really ruin your day if they know what they are doing.

So on OP subject - yeah, there are many TB players that are not very good.  I have not really seen any other TB do as well as me in games - which doesn't mean that I'm a gosu, cause definitely I am not... Though I have seen few ice TB that have done a very good job.

I found TB took a little while to get used to.  I think alot of people try to play fire torchbearer as a demigod killer because he puts out so much damage.  He fails at this though because he has a very short range with everything but fireball so he tends to die if he trys to go take down a demigod directly.  Fire TB is all about area control.  It's about saying "If you go here you are going to get 1800 damage and have to sit in a circle of fire!!"  This way who can control the flags, kill tons of creeps with your AOE and only worry about killing demigods if your partner gets a demi down to 1000 health in fireball range (which happens a decent amount).

Also yes I do think that pure fire TB becomes week late game.  I usally get frost nova because that skill is godlike after level 15.

I thought I was the only one who noticed this.  I've only played against 2 people that actually know what they were doing when it comes to TB.  The rest of the time I just consider it an easy free kill and roll them over.

All TB, all the time for me.

I'd say the real weakness of TB is priest minions. Harassing doesn't work when HP comes back faster than you can wittle it down.  

That statement about priest minions goes for any DG.  The only thing is that against fire TB, by mid-game, minions expire kinda fast...

Haha thanks for the guide link Itchy.  I love me some full frost TB, full fire is fun too but frost is so versitile.  I think the key with playing TB (as well as any other demi really) is knowing when you can win and when you can't.  You can't just use my frost TB then go toe to toe with a demi at all levels and circumstances without dieing.  You rain them, you auto attack, you back off when they charge, until they hang aroudn just a bit too long, then you charge in for the kill as they run and realize they can't get away.  Its pure joy.

fire tb is pretty much useless.

his abilities dont scale well either.

Welp, Teseer just schooled me with his hybrid TB, so I guess I'll have to admit both to being a miserable sedna, and that TB is quite capable in good hands.

I go fireball, rain of ice and ice nova.  2 good long range damage spells and an escape/slowdown spell when they get close.  Retreat a bit to tower and then hit them again with the 2 nukes.  Plus constantly switching gets you the mana and damage buff.  Oh and fist of the heavens for extra farming/dps

geez...

this demi is pretty good against towers, he can freeze them and take the flags.

his slowing aoe is good as well.

i play most of the time the frozen guy.

never tried the hybrid because i think its just stupid to change during the fight your tree.

Yeah, once you get the second level of freeze, you can pretty much solo two towers with no creeps helping as long as all the enemy DGs are busy.

http://www.gamereplays.org/demigod/replays.php?game=51&tab=upcoming&show=details&id=86949

Just finished a 2v2 as TB and won. Both teams were premade. Took me and my buddy a minute to realize that avoiding the enemy and farming their creeps was our best option early/mid game heh. We let the giants do most of the work.

Our team was TB and QoT. Theirs was Sedna and Regulus. I even think the reg got ashkandor.

I think this game illustrates the fact that TB's primary role is to support creep waves rather than kill enemy DGs.

*edit*

ofcourse the stupid replay seems to keep crashing the moment we kill their sedna

It's because it's not used to seeing Sedna die.

Anyway yeah half of TB's abilities are killer at creep farming.  I play all-ice so I just use Rain of Ice, which insta-kills a single wave once you get Rain II.  Fire has the Circle of Fire plus the Fire Nova, both of which destroy creeps.  A well-played TB in a random game will prolly outlevel his teammates, only kill the people who don't GTFO when they realize you're dealing way more damage than them as you run away, and have more gold than anyone.

Twas a fun game pseudomelon

ice = supporter / creep owner / (sometimes) killer ^^

fire = killer / finisher / CREEP OOOWNER 

and hybrid SUCKS!

Yarr, +1 for both being a good player, and being a fun guy to play a game with

Edit: Pooh Bear seems to be Karma-blocking me. Alas.

Double-edit: Stupid question, but is there some special software needed to run this video? Can't get it to boot off of Demigod or Media Player, or a couple of my custom video players.

hybrid doesn't suck...I usually only end up going hybrid for one or two reasons tho. 90% of the time its for the extra AoEs that the over mode can offer. The other 10% of the time its cuz for some reason I've decided that I need to be able to pick on my opponent from longer range ...so I'll add fireball to my ice build.