Rook Towers

Rook Towers can be summoned on a near constant basis, have 3 times the amount of health of a single creep and do decent damage, but give absolutely nothing when destroyed - no exp, no gold, no nothing. But they need to be killed, so I could spend my entire time combating these towers and fall behind in gold/exp income at the same time.

In short, they need to be worth something. There are absolutely no disadvantages to spamming these towers on a constant basis and it only hurts the players, literally and figurtively, that try to get rid of them.

2,825 views 12 replies
Reply #1 Top

Wouldn't this go for the general minions as well? Why would the towers need more of a reward for being destroyed than minotaur high kings?

Reply #2 Top

Well, I suppose the point is really that nothing should be worth nothing. If there is an enemy unit being summoned that offers no rewards, but must be killed - then there should be a reward for it. It begs the question "why should I spend the time killing this unit when I could kill that unit and get something for it" but at the same time "this unit hurts and needs to die, but I don't get anything for it". It's a strange and unnecessary dilemma.

Reply #3 Top

But why would someone want to pick a skill that gives the other team gold/experience, thereby giving the other team an advantage if you don't cripple them with the skill?

Reply #4 Top

Quoting Wogrim, reply 3
But why would someone want to pick a skill that gives the other team gold/experience, thereby giving the other team an advantage if you don't cripple them with the skill?
End of Wogrim's quote

Why should someone be able to cut off pushing of an entire lane with no disadvantage because no one wants to waste their time downing a tower that's worth nothing and can just as easily be brought right back up again?

I understand your argument from a General's perspective - why should minions be worth something when they die so easily? No one would ever summon them because you'd just be giving gold to the enemy. But at the same time, something that is difficult, but needs to be killed to further the game, but offers no rewards, simply doesn't make any sense since I could be spending that time furthering my own goals by killing someone or something that offers a well earned reward.

This is the fault of bad game design, unfortunately. Something still needs to be done regardless.

Reply #5 Top

Here's the disadvantage: gang up on rook, and he can't get away. All that time spent slowly moving his front line was for nothing.

By the way, if you can't get Rook out of the lane, go double team someone else. Rook won't be able to make it in time to help.

Reply #6 Top

Quoting incaseoffireburn, reply 5
Here's the disadvantage: gang up on rook, and he can't get away. All that time spent slowly moving his front line was for nothing.

By the way, if you can't get Rook out of the lane, go double team someone else. Rook won't be able to make it in time to help.
End of incaseoffireburn's quote

This is true except for teleports.  Allies can tele to the Rook's towers to help him.  If you try to gang up on someone else you've got a better chance because the Rook doesn't have his tower farm set up, but if you have to chase someone past the first tower he can teleport in, put a tower down, Boulder Roll to mess up your chase, and start whacking you with God Strength.  Oh, and don't forget those shoulder turrets are hitting you as well.  To beat the Tower Rook, let him have his flag and go around capping the other ones, and you should be able to get ahead in warscore and flag bonuses.  He can't afford to teleport all over the place, and his move speed is too slow to keep up with you (unless he got move speed items, in which case he's not going to be as good at fighting).

Reply #7 Top

Subjectively I can only say that the Rook should not be nerfed at all.

I very rarely encountered really dangerous Rooks and altough his tower farms are annoying, they are not too strong imho. Remember: It takes a lot of (dangerous) time and mana to set up a secure tower farm.

One thing I would like to see is that the towers should die if the Rook dies. Same as minions.

Reply #8 Top

Actually, Towers need a buff

Quoting CosMoe, reply 7
Subjectively I can only say that the Rook should not be nerfed at all.

I very rarely encountered really dangerous Rooks and altough his tower farms are annoying, they are not too strong imho. Remember: It takes a lot of (dangerous) time and mana to set up a secure tower farm.

One thing I would like to see is that the towers should die if the Rook dies. Same as minions.
End of CosMoe's quote

But that would be a nerf....

Towers actually need a buff.  First of all, less restriction on placement.  Seeing "aborted" when I try to place a tower at my feet or near a corner/edge/tower is really annoying.  Second, power of the tower 4 (the one at level 10) lets you have more towers and costs less mana, but you have to get mana regen items to have a decent tower farm back when they used to cost 400 mana, and the cooldown is too dang long to put down 8 towers for how relatively ineffective they are at that point in the game.  Either cut the cooldown in half, put the mana cost back at 400 and make it spawn 2 towers at once, or simply make the towers do a LOT more damage (OR HAVE SPLASH PLEASE).  The 3rd feature they need is for the chain effect thing to actually work to provide extra damage.  Putting towers near each other is the only way to make decent damage, but it gets owned by aoe and takes way longer than minions of minion builds to replace (and minions have an advantage of mobility, so they can run away from being owned anyways).

Reply #9 Top

In order for rook to get those towers in the numbers required to be a threat he really has to hamstring himself. Early levels you can almost ignore 1-3 towers to get a rook at 1/2 health, kill him, and make it to safety. Later levels the towers get knocked down faster than they can be set up. As a reg player I think they work out ok - if they need a buff then it's at the upper levels where they are pretty frail.

Reply #10 Top

Quoting grimunk, reply 9
In order for rook to get those towers in the numbers required to be a threat he really has to hamstring himself. Early levels you can almost ignore 1-3 towers to get a rook at 1/2 health, kill him, and make it to safety. Later levels the towers get knocked down faster than they can be set up. As a reg player I think they work out ok - if they need a buff then it's at the upper levels where they are pretty frail.
End of grimunk's quote

No you can't ignore the towers if they're hitting you.  2 level 1 towers do about as much damage as an autoattack (they each hit usually in the mid-80's).  If he's stacking health stuff (botf + banded are in my most common build) you're going to have a hard time outharassing him unless you've got minions taking all the damage for you, or you've got him outnumbered.

I forgot, I also want them to get rid of the "building" classification with regards to the scoreboard, because it's pretty sad that someone can get the buildings award (and thus favor) by killing my towers.  If the same applies to Generals' minions and "grunts" (reinforcements award), change that too.

Reply #11 Top

Getting rewarded for destroying towers (or killing minions, for that matter) would be like getting XP for every Fireball you survive, or gold for breaking through QoT's Bramble Shield.  They're an ability; they're not supposed to have any disadvantage other than the time and mana cost it takes to use them.

Reply #12 Top

Strategy fail batman... upgrade creeps and get priests tower rook is less of a problem.. he's utterly useless if you get catas first..but upgrading your little dudes armor and priests will hurt him a lot..