Nature's Reckoning: What gives?

1- You can get Nature's Reckoning much earlier than Wraps, so it does more damage through the course of the game

2- It's really only 'awesome' on Sedna, because it gives her AoE. If you're lucky, you can kill a creepwave while dps'ing another demigod. Your creep wave moves forward and attacks the opponent. This gives you roughly 5 x 15 + 2 x 12 dps so about 80 dps. This is all mana free.

3- It ignores armor, Wraps doesn't. If you're dps'ing for about 300 (which is pretty much only on a Reg with Mard's and popped wings assuming no debuffs and around level 8-9) wraps gives you 300 crit bonus, only marginally better than Nature's 250.

4- It's really only 'awesome' on Sedna. Mana == HP. Sed has no AoE... oh wait, I'm repeating myself.

5- It procs off of abilities (pounce). Wraps doesn't.

6- It's really only 'awesome' on Sedna...

It's AoE that isn't mitigated by armor. Thirty-seven damage is equal to a weapon that does 74 damage when your opponent has 50% mitigation. It's crap on Sedna, because her base attack speed is low. Higher attack speed equates a higher chance per second for it to proc. I use it on UB when I go for ultra-AoE.

http://forums.demigodthegame.com/353817

EDIT-It's the second best dps boost per cost of gold.  Thanks

Wat.

It can really help vs minion builds. Also +600 mana is nice, and 1500g is rather cheap.

Okay, so it is just a 'decent item' then, I'm not misunderstanding how people are deriving their damage from it.  Good. I thought everyone had gone blooming crazy.

I tried it on UB with fast attack speed from inner beast and stats, it procs more than you can imagine!

Mana=HP for Sedna. Getting this very early in the game (eg, as your third or fourth item) gives you additional mana for heals when you don't have the mana for it quite as much and helps recover not getting another Armor, such as Nimoth's since you can use mana to heal yourself.

You're doing it wrong if you're playing Sedna for the dps. Play UB or Oak.

The value of this weapon is not the unreliable 250 damage to a Demigod. It will almost never get you a kill, though it does help you push Demigods out of lanes. Why is this? Because it kills the creeps around him, your creeps move forward, dps on him. If gives a free (no mana, no cast) AoE to a character that has none, making the AoE component far more valuable than the actual damage it does to another demigod.

Plus, it marks all the creeps in the area, which gives you a larger gold flow.

The AoE component is what makes it so valuable for Sedna, not the damage to another Demigod. It's still welcome, but not the reason I get it. For other characters, such as a Beast, sure, then the damage to Demigod is what matters since he has Ooze on anyway which is probably killing most of the creeps to being with.

Anyway, yeah, higher attack speed means it proc's more often. Sure, that's math. But it's more valuable when it does proc to a Sedna than it is to other people, making it a comparitively superior weapon.

Tried this on sedna after reading this and boy! does that work nice!

Link to replay of sedna with Nature's Reckoning:

http://www.gamereplays.org/demigod/replays.php?game=51&tab=upcoming&show=details&id=98598

Nature's Reckoning has a 50% higher proc rate and provides 83% more damage on the proc. That is easily double the effectiveness of Slayer's Wraps.

It's not until really late game that Slayer's Wraps gets remotely comparable to Reckoning on a melee character.

Even level 10 Oak with max rank spirits and Soul Power hits for only 393-435, an average of 414. At 40% mitigation that's 248.4 bonus damage per crit, which only breaks even with the damage, strikes a single target, and occurs 50% less often.

Double damage only seems inaccurate if you make a few faulty assumptions:

1. You have a gold glut which has allowed you to stack an extensive amount of +dmg items without trading a critical amount of HP AND you have a spare item slot for the wraps
   
2. The AoE effect is always wasted
   
3. You have maxed out +dmg skills and ignored the much more popular damage abilities.

Seriously, Slayer's Wraps really are that bad on melee characters. Double damage from reckoning is not an exaggeration, and that's not even considering the unique utility the AoE proc brings, like allowing Oak to wipe out creep waves for bonus healing, senda having AoE period, general anti-minion utility without sacrificing single target damage, the extra mana, etc.

Tried this on sedna too, really nice to have! Especially once the other team has priests out.

err guys, especially obscenitor, you counted in that slayerwraps gives +30 weapon dmg on every hit?

and regarding the ub dmg calculation, are you sure ub does at level 10 only so few dmg? i remember him doing more as even sedna does  the same dmg with autoattacks. i know that demigoddb says this number but i think i saw him doing more dmg. i may be wrong.

edit: no the numbers cannot be correct. looked again on demigoddb and sedna does more dmg per hit than ub at lvl 10 while she hits a bit slower. thus the dps is more or less the same and this cannot be true at level 10. i allways saw ub hitting for significant more dmg than sedna at this and higher levels.

Celmare, I didn't even realize demigoddb was working again when I posted that. I got those numbers directly from the game, I started up a level 10 single player skirmish to do so. The numbers are accurate.

I did forget to add in the 30 damage from slayer's wraps so the difference will favor the wraps more, but not by much (only about +18 damage). Against 40% mitigation, on a level 10 UB that would be 154.2 damage per hit, making Slayer's Wraps provide 154.2 per proc at a 10% proc rate while NR is still 250 per proc at a 15% rate. So NR is still doing 62% more damage per proc 50% more often, which imo is equivalent to being about 90% better, still about double the effectiveness if you ignore the AoE completely and even better if you don't.

If UB doesn't have inner beast, Sedna DOES actually do more melee damage. She loses because of UB's insane spell damage and offensive attack speed reduction.

oh yeah and it is gives mana and aoe and cheaper yeah

interesting. but what is odd is that the demigodbd numbers are exactly, and i mean exactly yours but wihtout the +30 weapon dmg. you you say you have the numbers while you had slayerwraps on?

anyway it wouldn't change much now.

Yeah, I'm not sure where demigoddb's numbers came from, whether the guy actually took the time to write down stats at each leve, if he found the values in the lua files, or if there's just a linear equation for each DG's progression, but the DB's numbers are spot on.

I did not have wraps or any other items on when I got that number, which is why I forgot about the +30 damage altogether.

Do we know if Nature's Reckoning will cause post-mortem to be AOE as well? I've tried to test this, but it's too hard against the A.I. That would be friggin nuts if it did.

As in spread the debuff? I don't believe it will.

No, it will not. It has to be done by AA. However, Plague will (though it would be next-to-impossible to tell). For example, use Heavans Wrath on a Giant Creep Wave as a UB with Plague, you will infect them.