about deadeye grimonk, ive taken stun out alrdy and changed it to slow down enemies health regen by 50% and attack speed by 30% for 5 secs at a proc rate of 15. Now during late game its expected ull have fast attack speed, implying that you should be able to pull off this powerful debuff quite regularly.

lol trig. Funny you should say that coz someone told me he thought he was OP now

but I think these need to be tested over a longer period of time.

teseer. favor items shouldnt be taken into consideration when balancing a character because its a "favor" item. also when taking bots you dont have speed, or health etc.

If you have anything other than renewal you won't do enough DPS to do any good - unless you're a trap master, which no one is. You must use renewal to contribute to lvl 11, then you pretty much need to switch over to an AA build.

BTW, I tried Vengeance in a game. It really wasn't worth it. It either needs to do way more damage, or should be replaced with something useful.

its quite spammable though and can help against minions hordes late game, and dont forget, its FREE damage. It can be used as a form to clear minions from around ur cit if ur in a tight position. And while switching back to ur normal form use mines then switch to angel form again to maximise ur area-of-effect capabilities.

Its prob more effective than what you might think at first. Keep testing it though. Would like to make these characters as balanced as i can.

The damage done from full AF is faster and better and stronger than vengeance. I stopped using vengeance because it was just quicker to clear creeps with AF and mines - at lvl 15 it's giants time anyway. The other problem with vengeance is that it's useless in direct combat because of it's low DPS and reg's reliance of lifesteal items and autoattack to stay alive vs other demigods. If you're casting vengeance during that time you'll take damage for 2-3 seconds and not regen.

Mana is just not an issue that late in the game anyway. Perhaps if vengeance was available at lvl 10 I would be able to find a real use for it.

notes taken.

i think ill adjust the health regen debuff to 20%. and i might change motb slightly unless u guys think otherwise?

Unless you want to explain otherwise, this is not a valid test (ai has no idea how to play vs a reg and is still bad and those settings change the game ballance so meaningfull conclutions for an actual game can't really be drawn).

These changes will help reg but anyone who think he is now overpowered with them is just wrong.

These changes are perfectly fine (though still in oppinon not close to enough), adding stat debuffs to snipe is a good idea (adding +10/+20 percent damage taken to the last 2 levels of snipe for say 3 to 4 sec could be another inprovement (could use diffent figures)). No one except for full health ooze UB will notice the health regen debuff at 50 percent and since monk regen is not included (is this right?) a 20 percent debuff may as well not be there (idol regen >> item regen).

Edit: sedna might also this but will be able to remove debuff with heal pretty fast.

I do think you have taken the fun out of MotB as it stand though, there is now less insentive to fight without using abilities removing an interesting choice a player has to make. Could you make braking it more painful to break it or just add an interupt to it instead?Edit: If anyone is agressively attacking reg with the intent to gank then the change is just a poor version of tbs cold aura.

Not sure if it's possible to change the actual structure of the skill placement but if it is...

Link Snipe and Maim a la Erebus' ICA/Coven or TB's Deep Freeze/Fireball and make the final selection a 2 second stun.  Gives use to snipe late game even when the damage can't compete with health stacking.  Makes snipe a hell of a lot scarier when coordinated appropriately.  Gives Regulus a possible out if he's over extended.

If not, consider giving Snipe's final slot an AoE (think like Snipe + 3 mines at your current mine rank damage, min 300).  This gives significant punch and scales w/ your mine skill.  Also decent for strategic clearing of creep waves.

And how about changing MotB to doing 10/15/20% max health per rank, rather than static 400/600/800.  This way, Regulus has one skill that scales w/ health stacking.  The 20 second cooldown keeps it from being OP, imo.  If you think that's too powerful, keep the same %s but make it a DoT (say, 10 seconds).

Ok so what i tested is not directly as to whether i won or not but how well i could hold a lane/fight off other demigods, ganking capacity and general team support.

Setting used were to allow me to assess mid - late game impact of these skills, High all is the equivalent of just increasing the game speed but uses less computer resources. Also note that i used pepes Ai mod which uses real and metagame relavent builds for AI. Note that I would have tested against ppl but it is difficult to set up mods games.

20 seconds of visibility to the other team -50% health regen is a BIG debuff, no matter how you play it especially as it costs NOTHING but a single point in Tracking Bug, meaning that you can hold 2-3 ppl on perminant -50% health regen, let alone the ability of reg to use lvl 1 snipe to prevent regen of assasins (aka tower rook). Also note that MoTB is PERMINANT until a skill is used. Therefore demigods which have been debuffed by this skill now continuously suffer     

    - attack rate slowed by 5/10/15%
    - Dmg output reduced by 15/30/45

So now reg has:

*Attack rate slow

*damage output reduction

longest range attack in the game

*regen neutraliser - important lvl 1-8

3 different movement reduction skills , two of which reach the movement speed debuff cap on a non speed boosted demigod

2 AOE's

* These new skills greatly enhance regs support capacity,

ie. MoTB + tracking bug + diseased claws ooze ub = -55% attack speed, damage reduction of 45, 10% slow, -50% regen.

or -40% attack speed, -50% movement speed, -50% regen + 500 damage

IMO that is huge.

Since you took the time to explain it, ill put the time to explian why this test does not work. I am assuming that a semi compeditive game is minimium required test.

Though i have not played vs the AI mod but from the change logs it appears there have been been mimimal sucess in inproving its laning ability, that is it has less skill than the average player with 4 games has at holding a lane.

Just no, this is not at all equlivlent high all would definately benifit the ranged demigods.

All real ingame builds for the metagame (submitted by pros) assume that reg does not exsist (if there is a reg on the other team the idea would be to make a few changes drag the game out and win the 2vs2s to 3vs3s late game, and just enevitibly win). Playing against reg requires some degree of common sence wich unless programmed in computers do not have. Reg appears to be good when your enermy assumess reg is a joke, thinks that they will not run into double mines placed where reg has just been and none of the other player make any effort to ajust there builds and playstyles because there is a reg on the other team. Reg has some rather large problems when it comes to important roles in acually winning a game (can't 1vs1, 2v2, hold a lane protect a portal, block a flag lock or provent a tele out).

You do realise that regen from monks/priest with a health stack (not effected by this debuff) is many mutiples of that that can be gained from items and abilites. Most proper games every one on your team should have aleast one monk following them. This debuff does not effect monk regen and therefor is more like a 3 to 7 (guessing) percent health regen debuff and therfore can just be ignored. If this acutally effected monk regen then regs ability to effect things from a distance might actuall be good and make him unique and playerble. Apart from getting a second snipe (if they dont have a tele) the sight is pretty average and is a fair inprovement for a point.

AI is just not even close to good enough to test reg against, once reg can stand up to the minions of minion heavy builds then good players might publish artiacals for statergys against reg and then he can get some fair ballance. Once you realise how snipe and mines work and that they are being used by someone with resonable inteligence (could actually be smarter than you) you stop being supised that you got sniped or ran over double mines (they also have a 1 second cast time and can be interupted) and realise than full moral builds achive pretty much the same thing that reg can and do it much better, currently minions do not work vs ooze and Mass Charm but reg is even worse. These changes do help but still dont actually make him viable, though he closer under the mod to being viable and unique.

Yes, but ai on nightmare with low/high | exp-gold/HP is still decent to test against. The ai gets decent items and skills with the mod and they actually use them properly. It also gets 250% more xp than you, 250% more gold, it also starts off with enough gold that the ai get narmoths ring, a potion and a teleport.

However, i will not argue that it is not the same as playing against humans, but i am using non balanced games as a benchmark and making comparisons between them. I would be happy to participate in testing if anyone is interested tho.

I can do this, will post up code in a sec

wow what a load of text to read lol.

ill have to get bak to this...

you still coming back???

lol

i would, but alot of people seem so unappreciative of the mod and now make excuses not to play the mod because "you changed the wrongs things", "nerf the op demigods", "buff the UP demigods", the list goes on...

i dunno what to do coz so many ppl'z opinions are different  and if i got one way then i lose out on the other 80% of the 'possible' demigod players to try out the mod.

I would suggest that you host games with ur two mods and let people know in advance on the forum when u intend to host such games. also join people on vent channel and let them know about it. It will take time before people appreciate these changes.

I currently have connections issues with firewall at my university that's why I wasn't able to play online for the past month and a half (about 3 games lol). I would have happily hosted games with ur mods.