Not a fan of the economic system in 3.0

I believe that tourism is overpowered, currently, as well.  The whole wealth mechanic (along with taxes) are being overhauled and balanced, which is to be expected in an open beta.

I super-appreciate the market centers taking wealth, and giving approval.  Brilliant.

Yes, the whole economic system is completely to simple for a game like this. And there is absolutely nothing to do to generate much ammouts of money. That's total boring!

Same with food... nothing to do or manage to have a lot of it.

You need not to build much building to generate food and money so you have a lot of free tiles on the planets...

But for what??? Just to push production to build fleets... That's the simple level like stellaris! 

I guess the dev's want to make the game simple because many gamers wrote a negative review after 1 hour of playing because the game was to complicate for them.

Iam really disappointed! 

Looks like changes are still ongoing.  I started a new 3.0 game and now market centers can be built on more than one tile per planet as before.  I don't know if shopping centers are back yet because I've not researched that tech.  Tourism still appears to be grossly overpowered as before.

So my posts aren't entirely negative I want to stress that I really like the game and many of the changes made for the latest beta. 

Hovering over the Shopping Center in the tech tree, a Shopping Center is a downgrade from the Market Center. It has a lower percentage for colony income. Also, the Market Center gives +1 for Approval adjacency and no Wealth adjacency bonus (seems odd). Upgrading to Shopping Center loses the Approval adjacency bonus but gives the Wealth bonus. I doubt this is correct.

Is the final release of 3.0 out before Intrigue, this Wednesday?

Market Centers don't upgrade to shopping centers in the latest version (at least not with the tech with which they're grouped anyway).  As for the final release, I believe it is on April 11th.

But there is this line in Improvements.xml -> Shopping Center:

<UpgradesFrom>MarketCenter</UpgradesFrom>

In Crusade, there is no way to build a Shopping Center as the tech tree indicates, because of this line: <Unavailable>true</Unavailable>.

If both Intrigue and 3.0 are due out on Wednesday, I hope they clean up all of these stray issues first.

I see where you're coming from and agree you don't want to simplify the game too much, but remember most players play the game on Easy level and Small/Tiny Galaxy level. So they just want a quick and painless experience.

If tourism income is going to be this easy to generate, it should be this easy to disrupt (ie any pirates in your zone have a sharply negative impact on tourism income (at least 30% downwards until they are destroyed, for example), which is extremely immersive, as that's what happens on Earth.

The simplest solution - more Setup options at the start to personalize how in depth your control is. So you can do more things to get food if you want, more control over wealth creation etc. Those who want the easy game leave things as is...

If every aspect of a game is customizable and tailored... When is it no longer a game, but a mirror?

There's something to be said for the company to have enough vision to NOT make some things an option. 

Too many options can easily be worse that too few. The more options you have, the more time you have to spend testing each aspect of the things you add to make sure it's balanced in all options and combos. Eventually that would become impossible.

So very quickly you have people playing almost entirely different games and the feedback and criticism they send becomes almost meaningless since everyone is playing from a different baseline.

Personally I think they have done a good job of lettting the player concentrate on the overall picture and not be as bogged down in the details of food production and whatnot. The food is now relatively simple to manage and your decision point is which planet to put the cities and how to maximize your output based on what you are dealt.

As far as Tourism, it may or may not be too high but I'm sure that is just a matter of tweaking it to fit what they envision it's role being....ie, primary source of income or a supplement to trade/planets etc. It does give a good reason to push for Influence and expand your borders, something that was fairly unimportant before.

Your marketing slogan was " the biggest and complexest 4x game"! To simplify it and in fact you have canceled the complete economic and food management turned this game extremely in a simple grand strategy game. The free play is gone. All empire specific things happens by the way. The only think to do is to react to other empires. 

Now your own slogan why many player bought this game turned into the untrue! 

Sorry that's my opinion. Since beta I stand ever and ever behind this game and the devs. 

But this extremely simplify  tactic to get players back who's played only a hour and wrote a bad review because the game was to complicate is a slap in the face of all real fans and supporters

I have two space games as app on my mobile for free and the economic system is more complexe in both cases than this of Gal Civ. That's strange and in my opinion a wrong way because you will lose long term gamer and fans because new buyer who's play a couple of hour and than never again are more important to you. 

Sorry i am just very disappointed! 

Out of curiosity, what has really changed in the economic and food systems that has completely reversed the game from ‘complex econ’ to ‘overly simplified’?

 Is it because they removed the exploitable mechanics that allowed players to abuse the mechanics and break the game system? Sure, that took some time and effort to come up with but clearly it’s not what the designer intended to allow (ie, planets making 250 research or production etc).

 Are there other changes that were made which ‘simplified’ it? The Arable land mechanic does remove the decision as to where to put Food but the decisions before weren’t much deeper…mass up farms and crank the pop on a few planets to insane levels and break the game again.

 I’m not sure how else they can restrict things from being abused without putting limits on what can be done. Many people were unhappy with the removal of the ‘wheel’ because they loved to exploit it and they made the same argument….the game is being ‘dumbed down’. I guess I don’t see it that way. I see a loophole that needed to be closed.

 So are there other specific areas that have been simplified to ‘appeal to the masses’ that I’m not seeing?

Most people by the game to sit down, relax, enjoy and have some fun.  They don't buy it with the intention of changing it.  It's supposed to be playable and balanced the first time.  Well thought out basics, like an economic system, that are built upon with DLC's and expansions.  It is too easy these days to patch and change things.  I don't think dev's are taking there time and putting in the hours that it took when games came in a box. 

As for tourism being over powered.  It is.  Just remember that good moral pays when you can increase taxes. 

Influence now expands much more rapidly as well.  That has a role to play in why tourism is, in my opinion, overpowered.  I play a custom race I've intentionally crippled on a number of key statistics (including influence, diplomacy, economy and popularity (which affects tourism) and it's still a completely thoughtless process to reach massive wealth.  The economic output of the colonies is rendered immaterial as tourism income is an absurd 90% of total revenue. 

Be that as it may, I'm sure it's a relatively quick fix if they decide to change it. It's probably just tweaking a few variables here and there. I'm sure people abuse it and it starts to make a blip on the Metaverse, they'll look at it more closely and make adjustments (just as they have each time something is changed and people find ways to take it to places they didn't intend).

I'm holding judgement until they actually release all of the mechanics for Intrigue....

I suspect this is more balanced than it appears... 

I could be wrong however.

This thread was super helpful for balancing the tourism this past week btw.

You can keep tourism like this and make another game out of it as "Galactic Tourism"  

I'm glad it was productive. There is better balance in Intrigue than in the Beta.

Not sure I like this new market combined with the overbloated amount of money you make with tourism.Makes a big part of the game redundant  ala getting resources.The market needs to have a proper supply and demand ala ES2.

I love the way Tourism is balanced in Intrigue.  It is powerful, as is a Central Bank, and money can always be spent.