Frogboy Frogboy

My response to Bant

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My response to Bant

from WinCustomize Forums

Popular msstyle author, Bant, has taken his ball and gone home. Seems he's unhappy with the customization community.  In particular, he says that TGT Soft and Stardock are a disgrace to the skinning community.

You can read what he wrote here:

http://bant.deviantart.com/journal/2601098/

Bant is the creator of about a half dozen very good msstyles and 1 very good WindowBlinds skin.

Here's my response:

That's odd, I remember back in 1997 when we were designing what would become WindowBlinds and I just can't remember seeing anyone called "Bant".
 
 I remember when the first customization site, Customize.org got started, I don't recall seeing you there. And as the person who made the first skin that skinned the Windows GUI, I tend to think that this CEO of the "disgraceful" Stardock might have contributed something to the customization community.
 
 Now, in the 7 years we've spent working on WindowBlinds, which we provide a free unlimited downloadable version of that works on Windows 95 through Windows XP, I really have a hard time seeing how Stardock is somehow a "disgrace" to the customization community. I see Stardock as a group of people who have spent many many years working very hard to make it easy for people to customize Windows. Before Stardock came along, there was no Windows customization as we know it today. Feel free to go on archive.org and look back as far as you can at customize.org and you'll see what I mean.
 
 And of the software that we don't outright give away as freeware we sell for between $8 and $20 apiece Or about the price of a couple of pizzas.
 
 I also have a hard time seeing how Stardock is a "disgrace" when it put together the GUI Olympics, a contest in which skinners will make up to $15,000 in it.
 
 Or how about the freeware Stardock makes? BootSkin, ObjectDock, CursorXP, LogonStudio, and so on. Who makes more FREE customization software than we do that is anywhere near as widely used? We also pay for a website with no spyware, no popup ads that also supports our competitors. Hell, we host Samurize.com!
 
 Do you think the "customization" community as you know it just sprung up randomly? If it was so obvious, why did it take WindowBlinds to get GUI skinning going (eFX came later). Why weren't there IconPackager-like programs before IconPackager (iconphile and e-icons came later). There's still no CursorXP equivalent. There's still nothing quite like DesktopX, which, btw, is a free download and uncrippled. There's no WindowFX equivalent (beyond a few programs that add a few shadows).
 
 Stardock has worked very hard to contribute quite a bit to the customization community. It creates a ton of freeware programs and its non-freeware programs are priced trivially.
 
 And Stardock, as a group, participates actively in the community (such as me here and on Neowin and dozens of other websites).
 
 There are also skin authors now who are able to make a living creating skins.
 
 But more to the point, the skins didn't come first, the software did. The software is there for fun. People (like me) make skins because we enjoy doing it. Just like they make levels for Counterstrike or maps for Warcraft III or mods for Neverwinternights. Most people don't sweat that some developer might make money on it. It's supposed to be for fun.
 
 I'm sorry to see you go, I think you have a lot of potential as a skinner. But I take issue with you saying Stardock is a "disgrace".

9,280 views 35 replies
Reply #26 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Good point Frogboy.

If the people in the community don't keep working to make it a community, but rather have the attitude that it's all a big corporate machine, who will be left to make it a community.

Sure, some people will give up and blame it on the software companies, but maybe that's just an excuse of not wanting to put the effort in.
Reply #27 from WinCustomize Forums Top
That is exactly right Pictoratus. The fact that some people are quick to pin the fault on the products or the companies that make the products to shield the reality that they have lost interest or refuse to make an effort is what eventually breaks down the community. Situations such as this is what spawns so many clashes of ideas and oppinions which usually end up in flame wars.
Siege of Centauri
Reply #28 from WinCustomize Forums Top
brad, i meant that it doesn't matter that he has left the skinning scene. the accusations he leveled do matter and needed a response. sorry for the confusion.
Reply #29 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Um.. please, correct me if Im wrong, but didn't Stardock work with windows to make all that msstyles stuff?
Reply #30 from WinCustomize Forums Top
EinsteinContemporary, Stardock and WindowBlinds came first, by many years. only much later on did msstyles come along. remember, msstyles is winXP only. in comparison, i used WB on win98 for many years, long before winXP was even heard of.

there is a degree of cooperation between Stardock and Microsoft, but msstles was a fully Microsoft development.



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Reply #31 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I really don't have much to add.....all I can say is "ACK"
Reply #32 from WinCustomize Forums Top
All I have to say issss I remember Neoplanet! (thought it was so cool) hehe
and well it looks like yet another one bites the dust, and most likely others will spring up in his place.
Reply #34 from WinCustomize Forums Top
This guy got far more "press" than he deserved. He clearly has no understanding of the skinning community as a whole. Although there was someone else there lambasting Stardock as well. I really can't understand where this spiteful sentiment towards Stardock comes from.
Sure Stardock is in it to make money, but who isn't working to make money. Open source and free software are nice ideas, but in the end it doesn't last without some money. Even so Stardock has done its share to support the community in ways that don't require money.
I think some people are so afraid of admitting they are wrong, that that is why they continue to spout off incorrectly about Stardock. If anything TGTSoft I think deserves anger to be shot towards it for charging for a hack that can be obtained freely. To me that is deceptive. However since there is a market out there apparently for the gullible, they survive.

... I too remember Neoplanet. It was a shame it died, it had some nice ideas. Perhaps it arrived at the wrong time, seeing as alternative browsers are much more in vogue now.



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Reply #35 from WinCustomize Forums Top
/me pokes a certain dutch guy w/ a veryyy sharp needle...