This is precisely why hybrid rocks

I bet as soon as his auto-attack bug is fixed we will see 100s threads going OMFG FIRE TB IS SO OP!!!  Truth is there is nothing wrong with Fire TB, does what it's designed for exceedingly well and scales quite nicely...

Offcourse, unless it's a heavy interrupts matchup.  I mean cmmon, they couldn't have made all of his casts longer and more obvious.

Yeah I played fire again last night, I normally go frost now.  I'd say Misfortune is spot on.  As soon as you can autoattack while moving in fire form (if they ever fix it) they will be comparable again.  Fire TB with the aura for speed and damage can put out impressive auto attack damage, unfortunately you can't use it against enemy demigods at the moment cause of the bug.  When you can fire will be strong again, maybe not as strong as ice IMO, but much more viable.

Also I disagree with the posts that ice can't kill, its easy to get kills as ice with the slow aura, some speed on yourself, and rain of ice.  Rain drops so fast you can use it and still keep up chase on the auto attack.  Most the time when the enemy wants to run from me they can't so they better back off early enough or they are in trouble.  You don't charge in guns blazing and kill the enemy, you whittle them down till they don't realize they don't have enough left to stay then chase them down with snowballs to the back of the head.

Oh and both forms are super good at killing creeps.

I was thinking of working around some heavy straight up heavy AA build with TB.

Approach as fire, launch a FB, carry the stun and interupt. And basically shoot the fuck out of you with AA while carrying an interupt and stun.

If you are talking about switching to ice and chasing with AA then yeah you are correct that works quite well.  For me I don't even bother with the fireball part, usually I'll open with a rain of ice that hits them and the creeps around them instantly giving me a full army of creeps while theres are dead, then run in with aa blazing from there, its not much less damage than fireball and the cast time is faster.

Like I said, when/if they fix AA for fire so you can move and use it fire will be a lot stronger, as it stands if you didn't know Av as soon as the enemy runs you can't aa as fire, you just sit there chasing them and never shoot unless they are standing still.

[quote who="RobWild" reply="5" id="2290925"]If you are talking about switching to ice and chasing with AA then yeah you are correct that works quite well.  For me I don't even bother with the fireball part, usually I'll open with a rain of ice that hits them and the creeps around them instantly giving me a full army of creeps while theres are dead, then run in with aa blazing from there, its not much less damage than fireball and the cast time is faster.

Yeh, I was thinking of rolling in in fire, launch a neat fireball into their face, swithc to frost, ROI, AA spam them, freeze them, then interupting whatever at a key momment, then chase them down AAing them and finally switching to fire and a nice FB if needed.

You will not believe the amount of kills i've missed because i can't AA them while they run or switching to frost for AA, except, you stand still when you do...so you still lose them. bad times.

are you guys sure that this "auto attack bug" is a bug?

imo it's balance since you can launch the fireball when your enemy is running away .. you still cast it and shoot it.

fire tb would be way to imba if he could run and fire.

logically, and based of everything else in the game, it is a bug. but time will tell.

Unfortunately that won't work.  By the time you switch to fire he'll be on the other side of the moon.

BTW when switching to ice keep right clicking and he almost won't stop moving.  Only problem is almost isn't enough always

Yeah you can drop into frost pretty easily, problem is if you are using the auras is which form you are in determines whether its being used which is why I mostly don't go hybrid.

@TheManick - It wouldn't make sense that he is the only demigod that can't AA on the run, fire does not offer any legitimate benefit for not having it, and having it wouldn't overpower him imo.  As it stands fire is underpowered compared to frost for just this reason, if he has aa in fire it would be a choice of having some of frosts nice debuffs and utility versus fires pure damage.  Anyhow for serious competitive matches I usually only go frost now, I hope the fire auto attack is a bug and to me it seems like it should be.  I'd like to hear your arguments for how he would be "way to imba" in fire while having auto attack, but I'm not sure they are going to be compelling given your last posts logic.

TB takes some micro and skill, you are just getting horrible team mates. I play TB almost exclusivly and some games where I get partners that non stop feed I can still manage to pull it back towards the end.

Well I played a bit with a pure frost build, and a hybrid fireball+most frost abilities build yesterday, the Hybrid one with AA was by far more effective.

Float into combat in fire, launch a FB, switch to frost, drop a ROI some nice burst damage up front, Frost Nova, Deep freeze if i see them trying anything and with the extra damage just AA them down. Also you got the frost aura, so you can slow them escaping, or run the fuck away if need be.

Think i'll adopt it as my new playstyle instead of full fire

Congrats on seeing the light.  As an upside your fireball and deep freeze now will each do a max of 1350 instead of 1000

And it will be relevant as soon as you manage to get to level 20 without having won yet 30 minutes ago

You know Lugh, you do need to play against people for your expierences to be objective.  Kiling a thousand bots doesn't really prepare you for the real world

*snicker* lately I have been too tired to play against humans.  Except for my 3 closests friends. 

And there are SOME games that do last that long even in pantheon.

Lol, your kidding right?

Ok I'm gettin frustrated with this concept that TB just doesn't "scale well". FFS lets see a regulus with ashkandor hold off two lanes worth of giants by himself for any extended period of time.

*edit*

now if you guys wish to say "TB doesn't scale well against 1  target, specifically other players." Fine I think I'd be ok with that. But as the game escalate you tend to need LIVING creeps to keep pushing.

For Crist sake, please show me another DG that can do 400 dps against 60+% armor without artifacts.  And dont give me that Ashkandor shit cause if Ashkandor is in play so is Bulwark, rising that to 70% armor and 25% damage reduction. You'd need 1000 dps on an autoattack demigod to have the same end dps as the TB.  Sure autoattack is infinitely better with multiple damage artefacts stacked when you want to bash noobs with <4k HP and next to no armor at their healing crystal.  I agree, TB can't do that - but do get into a real game against a half decent TB and you will start fearing his damage.

Yep. TB is still quite fearsome in the end game. Don't know why people think otherwise.

Hmm, I just tried a hybrid TorchBearer going the burst damage route. I must say I rather like it. Open with fireball, then hit that quick fire AoE if they approach, switch to ice, fire off an ice storm, then use that shatter one whose name I forget. It gets brutal at the high levels. You can dump some 4000 damage (unmodified) on them over the course of just a few seconds and then chase them with your increased weapon damage from switching to ice.

I don't care if they have an HP build or not, they're gonna have to think twice about advancing after getting hit with a volley like that. You can be really, really dangerous.

torch is a joke to kill, really his spells need to hit harder. the only 1 that does decient dmg is that fireball

ignore the poor ignorant little person who obviously can't read or fails at making a joke

Having fun abusing pantheon with your team and bashing noobs???

It would be nice if classes had different mechanics. Reg is based off dmg and attack speed. TB should be based off dmg and spellpower. For instance instead of increasing his attack speed with "stats" and attack speed items, they should increase his spell power. Increasing auto attack and spell attack damage. "End game" is all about who can attack the fastest with the most damage. Luckily playing as TB I dont let them get that far most of the time. It would probably take to long to implement and balance now though...to bad. Maybe a future artifact at least...