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Demon Assassin Build - "The Viable" - UPDATED

Demon Assassin Build - "The Viable" - UPDATED

by DiceAreEvil

I replaced the old Assassin's Speed/Passive build.  It was fun, but getting kills is more fun.  The build plays pretty much the same way, only with spine attack.  The is key in finding those 1 v 1s to drop in on unexpectedly and finish the job.  All of the protips still apply.  You're not gonna have endless mana and you're not gonna be an unkillable tank.  You're not gonna be the fastest DG (possibly) until higher levels  But you will have burst damage, and a crazy swap GG move.  Use it wisely.

 

Level 1: Spine Attack I

Level 2: Demon Speed I

Level 3: Warp Strike I

Level 4: Spine Attack II

Level 5: Shadow Swap I

Level 6: Warp Strike II

Level 7: Spine Attack III

Level 8: Warp Strike III

Level 9: Save

Level 10: Spine Attack IV + Shadow Swap II

Level 11: Warp Strike IV

Level 12: Demon Speed II

Level 13: Demon Speed III

Level 14: Save

Level 15: Shadow Swap III + Deadly Warp

Level 16-20: Elusiveness to Assassin's Speed and a point wherever

 

Starting items: Scaled Helm + Scalemail

Favor Item:  Blood of the Fallen.

Alternatives:  Essence of Magic (only need Vlemish, replace plenor with an hp/armor item- like Duelist Cuirass, get banded and scalemail off the break)

Staff of Renewal

 

Item Order:

Banded Armor

Vlemish Faceguard

Unbreakable boots

Nimoth Chestguard (Sell Scalemail)

Plenor Battlecrown (Sell Scaled Helm)

Hauberk of Life (Sell Banded)

Narmoth's Ring (Sell Hauberk)

 

After Giants unelss you're raking in kills:

Hungarlings Crown (Sell Vlemish)

Groffling Warplate (Sell Nimoth)

 

Consumables:

Teleport Scrolls

Sigil

Flag Lock

 

 

At the start you've got Blood, some armor, and a bit of mana regen.  A nice mix, but you should still be careful.  Scare DGs off or soften them with a few ranged spine attacks.  Then Warp strike in and push with some auto attack.  Experience will tell you when you have the upper hand and can be the aggressor.   As always Unbreakable Boots are amazing so try to get those soon.  After then initial shop, you should always have a port on you, and once DGs start to hit level 6-7 you should always have a sigil as well.

When you play DA you want to crunch numbers really quick.  Mainly, how much mana you have left, how much damage a warp/spine attack would do, and how much HP your opponent has so you can determine the best way to kill.  Sometimes casting warp strike and spine immediately scare the prey off.  It may be best when you have the upperhand to Warp strike in, do some auto attack, then when they try to flee, hit them with spine attack.  Or, if you have the mana, a brutal Swap/Warp/Spine combo.

Also, the DA (much like erebus with bat swarm) excels at 2 v 1 ganking by Warp striking in,  Naturally, after you warp strike in for a 2 v 1, you should expect them to retreat, and so be ready to pull off a quick shadow swap followed by an instant warp strike.  Then try to auto-attack/warp strike them down until low enough to finish with a spine attack.  It is ideal to have superior speed as you will often need to cover some ground to start auto-attacking after a warp strike.  I prefer to at least put 1 point into Demon Speed early to assist with this.  Later on, build up speed even more after Warp Strike and Spine attack are maxed.

 

 

Things to keep in mind:

-Farm the squishiest DG.  I know this is gonna sound obvi, but be aware of how much HP the DGs on the field have.  Demigods like Reg and TB are pretty obvious choices, but depending on the player, sometimes they're not the squishiest.  I've seen terrible beast players with 3k hp while reg has 4.5k+.   I know it's evil, but if you're in a PUG situation it never hurts to peep the stats of everyone beforehand and secretly decide that you're going to make the worst player's life miserable.  That's how you play like the pros!  If you farm a horrible teammate enough you can overpower the stronger ones.  Key for DA victory.

-Remember that Shadow Swap can be an escape/saving move.  If an ally is getting dangerously close to dying, move to where you want the opponent to be, and then shadow swap him out thus saving your ally.

-Likewise, if you're getting flanked from multiple angles, Shadow Swap with the enemy who is in the best position to make an escape.  You often need to think fast as shadow swap is useless when they are both on top of you.

-Use warp strike to cover ground faster.  Use it to cap flags faster by targeting grunts on top of the flag.  Use it to retreat by targeting enemy creeps or towers behind you when you've pushed too far.

-Try to maximize the range of shadow swaps (without missing the swap of course).  This takes a little practice so you don't miss the swap, but run backwards or to your allies slightly right before a swap.  This gives your allies more time to get into a better position while renewing cooldowns for a second round of beatdown.

-Don't Shadow Swap for no reason.  I feel kind of stupid having to mention this, but I've seen so many bad DAs run up to me and open with a Shadow Swap.  Why?  I have no idea.  They just wasted mana and a cooldown on a good spell.  If you're going to Shadow Swap, make sure it serves a purpose like prolonging a retreat or pulling Demigods into mines or your allies or behind towers.

-Be quick with Shadow Swaps to counter things such as Robust Healing Pots and Portals.

 

 

R.I.P.  old build.

Credits to this Build:

Shred_Demon (who uses a very similar build)

Naur (ditto)

Anyone else who's sucked it up and played DA enough

 

13,498 views 37 replies
Reply #26 Top

Edited- same build as above

Reply #27 Top

why essence of magic ? a 45 second cool down isn't nice . o.o

IMO, i'd rather you get magnus rod, spend a little more on hungarling's crown and you can spam spine attack + warp strike all you want .

magnus rod and spine attack both have a 15 second cool down .

save your favor item for something better e.g. BotF

Reply #28 Top

Quoting STYJ, reply 27
why essence of magic ? a 45 second cool down isn't nice .

IMO, i'd rather you get magnus rod, spend a little more on hungarling's crown and you can spam spine attack + warp strike all you want .

magnus rod and spine attack both have a 15 second cool down .

save your favor item for something better e.g. BotF
End of STYJ's quote

 

Getting the gold for hungarling and magus takes time, and a lot of gold to solve a mana problem.  And honestly with Essence I don't even need them.  Essence has a really nice passive regen thats great early game for soften up other players with spine attack.  And late game all of those free spells add up.  Basically I'd rather spend that 8k on hp items and sigils than mana ones.

Reply #29 Top

Quoting grant_nick, reply 24
Thank you for one of the more well formed discussions concerning the viability of a particular DG build.  The summary of arguments for and against this build seem well thought out and laced with a fair degree of critical thinking.  It's very refreshing   I am anxious to try this set-up out as I feel I am overly dependent upon Spine Attack, and have generally disfavored Warp Strike. 
End of grant_nick's quote

Yeah, the goal of this build was the give Warp Strike some love, for both its damage and its ability to put you in a good position to melee.

Having played both this build and the Spine/Warp build I posted above quite a bit, the spine build is definitely easier for getting kills against mediocre/decent players.  But honestly most of the DAs I've played against have been pretty bad no matter what they do.  Maybe it's their teams fault.  Maybe it's their fault.  Probably both.  I think both builds are viable and I do use both.

If I am convinced the Essence build is better, I may replace the build on this page. But honestly I don't like this whole idea of "1 true build" like people say about beast with spit/ooze, etc.  I also like builds that go against the grain.  It's just that much more fun owning people with them.  I've smoked people with an angel auto-attack/mards hammer/gaunlets of brutality reg with kills of the break because they didn't expect to get hit by a 200+ dps auto attack at level 1.  And I love speed ooze beast, you can cling to people till they drop dead.  They're used to getting spit on and retreating.

Reply #30 Top

I've had some major luck with DA as a support build, like regulus SHOULD be done.  You had some really good points, though the warp strike and tail is the way to go, imho. 

Also, I've had luck between BotF and Heaven's Wrath, to look for creeps that aren't being used, to skip warp area, so I can keep my levels even or above the others.  DA needs levels bad, obviously.

 

My best luck is to pair up with a tank DG, go in and do a nuke on whoever he is hitting, to scare that DG back off.  Try to use the confusion to single out the other DG that didn't run, to get the advantage.  Just keep pushing them off, and using Wrath on extra creeps (don't be a dick and steal! Looking at some of you regulus players!).  Once shadow swap is up, it's open hunting. 

A good tactic, probably obviously, is to nuke the DG that you're teammate is focused on, then swap him in mid health.  I realize that the enemy MAY tp out on you, but they are in panic mode, so if he's getting out, go after the other DG and push them off the flag.  It's not all important to get ganks for $ and levels.  It helps and may even win the game, but it's (unless you're great) more likely that the TEAM advantage will win the game vs your personal advantage.

Reply #31 Top

Having played both the Essence build and the Viable (life) build for a while now I'm going to have to admit the Essence build is superior... at least in most circumstances.  This Viable build started off as a concept build to make the DA as unkillable as possible which is fun but you definitely miss out on kills by not taking spine.  So I can't wholeheartedly recommend a build without spine attack despite my efforts to try and make one.

Is the Viable build bad?  No, it's OK.  You kill less, but probably die less.  But I feel a well played Assassin would know his limits and benefit more from increased firepower.

So there you go.  The Essence build is better.  I'm thinking about replacing it and rewriting the guide, because I have been having a lot of fun with it.  If I come up against a team that shuts down the Essence build, I will no doubt give "The Viable" another try to see if there is a niche for it in certain matchups.

I'll probably change this guide sometime this afternoon when I'm bored at work...

Reply #33 Top

Quoting STYJ, reply 27
why essence of magic ? a 45 second cool down isn't nice .

IMO, i'd rather you get magnus rod, spend a little more on hungarling's crown and you can spam spine attack + warp strike all you want .

magnus rod and spine attack both have a 15 second cool down .

save your favor item for something better e.g. BotF
End of STYJ's quote

 

I dunno about you but Essence pretty much solves my mana problems with only 1 helm.  And the 7 mana sec regen early game is huge.  Late game when Warp Strike and Spine Attack cost ~1000 mana each you're saving 2000 mana or so every 40 seconds.

I've always had trouble making room for magnus when you've got the holy trio in consumables- locks, ports, and sigils.  I do like magnus on reg, though, with the renewal favor.

BotF is good, though.  Against a high-level team, you would probably need to go Blood, just to compete early game with a team that also stacks Blood.  But if you can get away with using EoM early game, it's great the whole game and generally makes using his abilities much smoother.  I rarely miss kills as a result of not having mana, or have to retreat because I'm oom.

Reply #34 Top

lol ya I was wondering if you were going to change your mind on the build :P

 

idk.. personally when I play DA.. I feel the need to get the dmg out.  I'll eventually pick up demon's speed if I need it.. but I definitely don't like to automatically pick it at lvl 3.  WS / attack, Spine, Swap if they're slightly faster while running away, ws / attack, Spine usually does it w/out speed.

 

Also, Dice is a great player.  I wondered how someone would make a build work with assassin's speed.. it's a sweet talent, but takes so much to get there.. dunno.

Reply #35 Top

I really like speed on DA.  Running around and capping flags is a major source of xp for me when leveling him since he doesn't kill grunts so hot.

Also, without stacking hp blood and dodge he really gets the short end of the stick statwise. As Frogboy mentioned in his DA post, an Ereb/Oak would have 4k at level 4 while he gets like 2.3k.  He really needs to GTFO once a group of DGs decide to focus on him.  Plus he starts off slow as crap, erebus food.  Bollocks. 

I keep getting owned by bite/penitence/snipe, bite/penitence/spit grasp, bite/penitence/insert anything here.  Even popping a sigil and running with demon speed 3 it's game over when bite and pen get high enough level.  Reg has some kite-ability with slow mines and maim or mark, torch has frost nova/auras, but DA really doesn't have much to get people off of you if you don't have a support DG to help.  I think I might even need a wand of speed or possibly something like orb of defiance for protection until the cooldowns are reset.  I NEED SPEED.

Also speed helps position yourself for clutch swaps.  Sometimes a DG is just out of range of a swap but if you close the gap just enough you can grab them and it's game over.

But yeah, I do like Assassin's Speed.  It's just looking to be a late late game skill.

Reply #36 Top

Well, this thread is basically going to make no sense now, but I've updated the build.  Thanks for all the input.  For those interested in the original build, it was basically getting more speed early, replacing spine with dodge, and stacking HP with Assassin's Speed at 15.

 

Wooo.

Reply #37 Top

Bump for n00bs looking to try DA