Momentum shift - late game turn arounds don't happen

I agree. Past a certain point, the result of the match is set. Often, it can be very early. It's not really fun knowing that there's really no risk in attempting to kill somebody, because he and his teammates can't possibly hope to kill anyone in your team right now. They have too little health/armor/damage, you have too much.

I'm not really sure there's a way to offset this, other than to provide an "OH SHIT" button on a long cooldown in your base which will give you a large benefit for a short time. If your enemies don't know to avoid this, it could give you enough xp/gold to even it out.

They can happen, and i've had them happen for me.  What you want to do is focus on your citadel if they enemy is not.  You can turn the momentum around with some great upgrades there so that your creeps are overwhelmingly stronger.

Be careful not to do too little too late though.

I have turned games around MANY times, what I do is focus on killing their defenses as well as upgrading the citadel, that way your minions focus on their minions/demigods.  I've won games up to 10 levels lower than opposing demigods on fortress/conquest/domination games.

Aren't there certain items that function sorta like that?  I am a new player so I don't claim to have any experience on the subject, but looking through the items I did see some expensive consumable that seemed to give large bonuses.  I'd imagine if the loosing team used them in tandem it could have an effect...maybe not though.

I agree that we need a surrender/concede button, but I think momentum can shift - at least on a map like Prison. 

I think the main reason games take a long time to end once they've been decided is because people don't know how to use the citadel.  If you're completely dominating a match, just rush to giants and boost their damage.  Those guys will penetrate defenses and bring down a citadel in a snap if the enemy is not prepared for them.

It's just a matter of knowing the right way to finish a match.

I pin victory at the exact moment a team gets catapults. Until that point, it's anyones game. Demigod's themselves do not carry enough sway to decide a victory earlier, other then just dominating flag control of course, or whatever your game mode may be. Obviously there are exceptions, like one team just relentlessly beats down the other early on.

I've seen some pretty cool turnarounds happen. Though it really depends, it does need pretty even teams too. If the other team gets to the point where they're getting artifacts while the the other team is struggling, it's pretty much impossible. Like, one DG singlehandedly beating two and such.

On the snakey map (whatever it's name was), it's actually annoying how the game can turn. The crystal is so close to the citadel that the defending team can just farm there, if not totally outmatched. That's only problem on Conquest mode, though.

It does feel really annoying to spend the last 15 minutes or so when opposing team has some really strong DGs, but the creeps just aren't getting anywhere. Try to turn the tide and get killed, or defend and delay the inevitable. Still, it's not nearly as bad as it was, well.. in DotA.

I think that killing DGs may give bit too much gold. Say, somebody on your team has a bad early game, doesn't know his DG or whatever. Opposing DGs get better gear when killing him, which makes it still easier to kill him again.. it feels like pushing as a minion general just isn't nearly as effective as killing people.

Usually the good players try to end it as fast as possible. *shrugs*

There only aren't shifts when one team is outmatched.  A team usually gets early momentum and keeps it simply because they're better.

I've seen turnarounds happen except on slaughter.

This.

I've been in a few incredible comeback games.  However, a concede button would be very nice.

Okay, but see, citadel upgrades could be the triggers to these big momentum shifts too. They are directly tied to your gold rates. Say your opponent is out producing you in gold and gets access to some strong citidel upgrades before you do. The extra time it takes to kill their newly upgraded reinforcements means your gold and exp rates start dropping off, and theirs will likely stay the same. The new reinforcements are also more likely to force you to play carefully and avoid taking damage, further hindering exp/gold gain. When you finally buy the equalizing upgrade your opponent has had the interim time to collect more exp and gold than you, and the cycle continues when they purchase the next upgrade before you again.

I guess I should be careful using words like 'impossible', but what I'd really like to communicate here is how rare and difficult it is to see things swing back after they start moving in one direction.

Edit: Whoa, okay, there was a flurry of responses there. A lot what I'm reading sounds a little dismissive; not in a 'lrn2play' way, but more like "people just don't understand how to turn the game around with the citadel". But citadel upgrades are driectly tied to the momentum that has already been established in the game! It doesn't get around the problem.

I disagree.  If one team has a Rook, catapaults are not necessary. 

I've definitely experienced a few comeback games from both sides.

First one was us being fighting a losing battle at the gates to our citadel.  Spending gold on uprading the citadel helped, but what clinched it was ignoring the enemy demigods to a center flag they didn't cap, then moving on to their base and capping their valor flags, making our reinforcements much stronger.  They tried to take it back but never recovered from that.

Another game we were ahead and held the middle flags, but they got lucky and killed both of us, and that was enough for them to keep their momentum and beat us.

I feel TC answered their own question.  If you're aware of the what events could possibly shift the balance of power to one side and thereby preordain the winners of the match why don't you take advantage of it.  The other team obviously did.  i do agree that if enough momentum is built you cannot stop the onslaught for that match, but there's always another match and an opportunity for you to create the momentum and steamroll someone else.

If something like Valve implemented for TF2 and L4D that constantly evaluates each side's performance and changes in-game elements and factors to keep the game balanced it could change gameplay.  The quesiton we have to ask ourselves is "Isn't this what the developers wanted when they made the game - half gods becoming supreme beings, not half gods playing nice with one another?"

I could see gold costs altered for the winning and losing sides appropriately to permit the losing side to compensate for a likely level gap between them and their enemy, but beyond that it seems that we'd be robbing too much from the game's premise.

Something I'd really like to see are diminishing returns from high-frequency kills and from higher level gods killing lower level gods.

Yes, sometimes the curve is bucked, but  see Should there be a resign option?

Actually this is the point when momentum is most likely to shift.  If your opponents get catas and can't complete within 5 waves or so then your level and gold advantage will be decisive.  Farm the larger grunts before they hit your base and you can turn it all around.

I disagree. I was playing a four vs four on the map set in space last night, and our team was stuck for about an our inside our base getting constantly smashed by the enemy (inc Giants) but they just couldn't kill our citadel. We were all to close to the health stone. The only reason the match ended was because I crashed.

That's why you have to pay attention to what you do the whole time not just at the end and is exactly why the game is interesting.

My first game had my team-mate and I pushed back to our citadel on crucible  but we maanged to pushback due to use focusing on getting rid of the of creeps forcing the demi's to pull back. Ending up getting mageslayer then eventually the all-father ring as UB and came back to win the game. Personally think the rarity makes it that much more fun.

Actualy the few losses i have gotten, we were pushing close to there base, and since our creeps where beating there creeps, they got more exp. Leveled up quicker. hiding by there towers.

And Really end game gear selection can make all the difference in a turn around. I was playing a demigod match that was 17-4, My rook partner kept running out and getting owned by there rook regulas combo.  There rook was level 20 befor i was 12. Soon as i hit 15 and got the crit sword it was gg.

I disagree with the right strategy the game can be easily turned around. I won a 5v5 with me v 2 humans. My citadel had 10k hp left and I turned it around. Game went on for 1 and a half hours final score.

http://s126.photobucket.com/albums/p115/tripled153/?action=view&current=Longestgameever.jpg

Wish I had a replay though because when i turned it around other teams head exploded.

Okay, but did you see any possibility for pushing your opponents all the way back to their base and beating them? Not gonna happen. As it is you are just stalemating the game for awhile...

And @ armagh1098, it doesn't matter if a team doesn't understand why they lost; hopefully they will learn how to better utilize the options available to them. What matters is there is no incentive to continue playing until the very end of the match. Players realize there isn't any hope of turning this round into a victory, and there is no penalty for leaving (save for its rude and inconsiderate). 

Price adjusting is a possible tweak to level the playing field, but I think you could make a much more exciting and engaging  solution. Like say if a team is really up against the ropes, the citadel could occasionally send in a wave of ultra-strong rare reinforcements to allow the losing side to push back into the middle ground and flip some key flags. Or maybe gift one of the weaker players a random artifact to help close the gear deficit. These sort of events would keep players on the edges of their seats right until the bitter end of the match.

In Darkness and Light (anyone?), game almost exactely same like Demigot but inferior to it, there actualy was a solution for this:

If the game run long enought (as far as i remeber it was 25 minutes by default), and one team didnt manage to overrun enemy by that time (destroy their citadel), two boss monsters spawned in both bases. Each boss has had its health and damage based on its team score. But even the weakeas boss was superior to any player on the map. When monsters clushed in battle, players had to support it and kill enemy players to prevent them from helping their boss. When one of the bosses was defeated the game ended.

I think something like this could be implemented in Demigond in some distant future. That would ensure that game would last long enough for one team to lose all hope and keep the tense to the very end of the game and people not getting bored with loosing. In Demigod it could be some kinds of constructs or something... but i think it would fit and make the games fun.

Wait, so honestly, the impression I'm getting is that no one thinks there is a problem here. The game is perfectly suited for crazy late-game upsets. There is absolutely no problem with the late-game in its current state.

I'm... I'm sorta at a loss for words. This has always been a problem for AoS-style gameplay, but apparently something magically changed in DG and everybody forgot their problems. Well forget it then, let things carry on the way they are. But I promise you if this issue of turning momentum around was addressed you'd see a lot fewer quitters in games.